Ultralight suspension - hardware vs knots

[FLTurtle]

That doesn't make any sense to me.
The height required is going to be the same whatever method you use... Or am I missing something?

Oh, now I get your question..."overhead", he doesn't mean overhead referring to height on the tree. He's referring to overhead as in excess length of the whoopies caused by the bury.

Never used whoopies, so I dunno much about the tips and tricks using them. How does the "double up to shorten" part work?

[Singlespeed]

Alternately, if you know how to make your own whoopies you can place the bury very close to the fixed eye. I've got a pair like that (somewhere in the attic ) that shorten down to about 14" or so.

Absolutely. I just can't be bothered when these whoopies are in good condition.

Waits for someone to argue that's going to be like xxgrams heavier to keep the same maximum length

[cmoulder]

Absolutely. I just can't be bothered when these whoopies are in good condition.

Waits for someone to argue that's going to be like xxgrams heavier to keep the same maximum length

Indeed... I think it's going to be something like a whopping 5 grams.

[Shug]

I did a whole Suspension Series that may give you some insight.....https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...RN4_MaZ8UAyzWm

So many ways and various weights on each item of the suspension. Worth looking at vendor specs and perusing the options.

Shug

[MikekiM]

Take a look at AutumnUltralites Breeze buckles. From my recent research these might be the lightest. But like may buckle systems you have to a heavier strap so it kind of neutralizes any weight advantage in the buckle.

Kevlar is the only UL strap I like given it stays a strap and doesn't bunch up onto a cord-like shape. 2.2 is my favorite, 1.9 next and 3.3 is last.

New hangers can benefit from buckle systems as hammock setup isn't as intuitive as it will be after years of practice.

[TxAggie]

For your first hammock setup, the Beetle Buckles are an excellent, middle of the road first setup. You get a feel for how far apart your trees need to be without the worry of them being too close for whoopies or the concern over using knots.

The reality is, suspensions are relatively cheap and you’ll likely find yourself with several different configurations within a couple of years after you get the basics down. Starting off with a buckle system helps limit the number of variables you’re working with while learning a pos setup.

Good luck and happy hanging.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[cougarmeat]

Yes, it was distance “overhead”, not distance “over head” With the loops and (8 inch) bury, whoopie slings can add about 2 ft to the required distance between trees.

Sometimes it seems these options are compared as if everything is equal except the weight. If that was the case … drum roll … of course ligher is better. But it’s all a compromise. It’s not, “I want the lightest.” as much as it’s “I want the lightest and I’m willing to to give up some convenience and limit some of my site choices for that oz or two.” Or I want the lightest and I’m willing to risk some gear failture to get it.”

I’m not saying light gear is wrong. I’m saying there are two sides to the equation - what you get and what you give up to get it.

[cmoulder]

Yes, it was distance “overhead”, not distance “over head” With the loops and (8 inch) bury, whoopie slings can add about 2 ft to the required distance between trees.

Sometimes it seems these options are compared as if everything is equal except the weight. If that was the case … drum roll … of course ligher is better. But it’s all a compromise. It’s not, “I want the lightest.” as much as it’s “I want the lightest and I’m willing to to give up some convenience and limit some of my site choices for that oz or two.” Or I want the lightest and I’m willing to risk some gear failture to get it.”

I’m not saying light gear is wrong. I’m saying there are two sides to the equation - what you get and what you give up to get it.

I have not encountered gear failure or site selection as factors but then I've only hammocked a grand total of 5 nights in the PNW, otherwise all my hanging is here in the NE. One can avoid crazy-light—say, a monolite hammock with 2mm dynaglide for suspension—and still remain reasonably light and robust. A DH Darien Mtn 1.3 with 3.3 kevlar would come in right around a pound or so and is quite durable.

Convenience is definitely a factor when just starting out because it does take a considerable amount of effort and practice to develop a feel for distances, hangles, height etc, and combining these obstacles with tying knots can be overwhelming and frustrating. So simple setups with straps/buckles or your daisy chains with a couple of 19-gram carabiners certainly helps at the outset.

But the OP did put "Ultralight" and "knots" in the thread title. And for better or for worse, that's my thang.

[cougarmeat]

On my own, hiking, not kayaking, it would be much easier to find non-challenging trees. But when there’s a need/desire to setup near ground sleepers, or restricted to an official “campsite”, sometimes the choices can be limited. Kayaking can also limit choices as there are either defined camp areas or an expectation that the kayaker will camp on or near the beach; not a lot of access to the interior. If I’m with my friend who likes the Ridge Runner, I give the wider trees to her. It’s not uncommon to run my GE almost from trunk to trunk. Doesn’t make my tarp very happy. But I’m just now realizing I could turn it sideways - assuming basic good weather (which I target for).

I’m getting closer (UL); this summer I go back to straps and buckles. If I do use the daisy chain, I’ll skip the heavy stuff (Atlas, Python straps) and use a very light set I picked up on KickStarter or Dutch’s spider straps.

For me, it’s picking the right knots. For example, I’m not a fan of the taut line hitch because of the need to wrap with the full line length (yes, you could double it and just warp the loop) - that is, pull the cord around and around. But then I discovered other slide/tighten knots (that I can’t spell) that don’t come loose when the line is slack. And I did go through a Soft Shackle stage when learning to work with Amsteel. I could replace those biners

[droney]

The lightest knotless high weight bearing suspension system currently available is a Venom strap connected to a single strand of Amsteel, a hammock with dogbones/continuous loop connected to a Turtle Tie from fugal innovations. The system is demonstrated here (he uses heavier straps though).