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  1. #21
    cmoulder's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    Ossining, NY
    Hammock
    DH Darien #6235, #7111
    Tarp
    HG hex, hex w/door
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    Enigma, Incubator
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    Kevlar, Lapp Hitch
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    3,697
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ldog View Post
    Well ... I do tend to take care of my gear ... Probably why it takes me so long to pack in the morning ...


    I am a wordy mofo ...

    Some of that primer is out of frustration over some's rants as to how they don't understand other folk's "obsession" with base-weight, and suggesting that "worn weight" is just a way to achieve a desired base-weight driven status. And all the stories of folks being asked by someone carrying a UL load if they can borrow something ... And those who suggest the only stat that's important is total weight, and that people worried about pack weight should instead just get some **** exercise and lose excess weight around their middles!

    Jeesus ...

    On the other side, the UL forums ARE full of folks that appear to be blindly pursuing specific base weights to be able to claim they've achieved what I consider to be arbitrary standards of UL/SUL/XUL. Arbitrary cause they do not take into account mission or wx.

    I believe one can learn a lot from the original tenants of the UL philosophy. Looking at everything with a jaundiced eye - Do I NEED this? Do I carry anything else that will do the same thing? Is there a lighter version I could carry that meets my needs? Can I do the same thing with stuff I find in nature?

    (I'm not leaving TP at home and wiping my butt with pine cones.)

    The load I carry is driven by mission and weather. If I'm packing out to a lake for a week of fishing. I'm going to carry a big frying pan. But I'll carry the lightest I can find that will fry the size filets I wanna put in it. OTOH, I don't need any kinda frying pan while hiking long distance. And I try to do that in the sweet spot of time after the bugs and before the cold nights so I don't have to carry heavier, and bulkier quilts and base layers.

    But if I ever do, I have a pack for that ...

    Then there's those who don't see any advantage in obsessing over lighterpack type spreadsheets. Guilty. It focuses me on areas where I could lighten my load. It helps me determine if I really can rock that light, frameless backpack. It's why I occasionally think I'll use that DCF tarp with a light bivy, shorty mattress pad and TQ, and leave my hammock at home. That would drop my base weight down into that arbitrarily established 10 lb UL base weight area. Yay!

    Nah! Maybe I'll just stuff my pockets with 1.6lbs of random things and call it Worn Weight...
    Pretty much where I am.

    Done enough UL-ing by now that I evaluate the trip and pack what I need and it weighs what it weighs. Which is always lots less than what it was in the pre-enlightenment era.

    But I like the other qualities of DCF tarps enough that I'd carry them even if weight wasn't a primary concern.
    Five Basic Principles of Going Lighter (not me... the great Cam Honan of OZ) Instagram (me!)

    “To equip a pedestrian with shelter, bedding, utensils, food, and other necessities, in a pack so light and small that he can carry it without overstrain, is really a fine art.” ~ Horace Kephart, 1906

  2. #22

    Join Date
    Sep 2019
    Location
    Long Island, NY
    Hammock
    HG Wanderlust
    Insulation
    EE TQ, HG UQ
    Posts
    292
    Quote Originally Posted by Ldog View Post

    On the other side, the UL forums ARE full of folks that appear to be blindly pursuing specific base weights to be able to claim they've achieved what I consider to be arbitrary standards of UL/SUL/XUL. Arbitrary cause they do not take into account mission or wx.

    I believe one can learn a lot from the original tenants of the UL philosophy. Looking at everything with a jaundiced eye -
    Nice, thoughtful post.
    Yes! The internet has democratized/crowd sourced so much information and I'm not sure people read and analyze before jumping on board a bandwagon to replicate or emulate what they read online. If (insert name of UL influencer) carries (insert product name) then I too will enjoy backpacking! And when that doesn't work out, move onto someone else's gear list or switch sub-reddits.

    I may not get to UL based on the types of trips I take and the amount of $$ I'm willing to spend to lighten my clothes (last remaining heavy items), but I keep a notebook and list out all the unused items each trip, and make sure to leave them home the next time if the conditions allow.

  3. #23
    Senior Member Rolloff's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Leveland
    Hammock
    Bonefire Whisper
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    HG DCF Hex
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    Sheltowee JRB SS
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    Bonefire
    Posts
    2,337
    The extremely nice thing about including a hammock in any UL or LW kit, is when you end up a pound or so over whatever your target weight may be, it's all pretty much comfort.
    Signature suspended

  4. #24
    Ldog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Northern Michigan
    Hammock
    DutchWare Half-Zipped (Hexon 1.0)
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    HammockGear CF Hex
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    HG UQs and TQs
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    Huggers w/Whoopies
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    98
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    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Rolloff View Post
    The extremely nice thing about including a hammock in any UL or LW kit, is when you end up a pound or so over whatever your target weight may be, it's all pretty much comfort.
    Yeah! My "shelter" weight is competitive (if one is into competitive spreadsheets). But my two quilts are about a pound heavier than a comparably rated sleeping bag. And cause I carry a sleeping pad for when I have to go to ground or choose to sleep in a shelter.

    [Sigh ...] I'll never be UL if I keep making decisions like that!
    L.Dog
    AT 2000 Miler/ 1752 Hangin' Miles
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  5. #25
    all secure in sector 7 Shug's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Minnesota
    Hammock
    I have many so....
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    Blackcrow DIY Tarp
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    FrankenquiltUQ/Pod
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    Whoopie Slings
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    Though I have Dyneema tarps, I usually grab my silpoly or silnylon one for a trip.
    Tough to explain.
    Shug
    ShugArt Hammock Paintings....https://www.etsy.com/shop/ShugArtStu...platform-mcnav

    Whooooo Buddy)))) All Secure in Sector Seven

  6. #26
    Senior Member Rolloff's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Leveland
    Hammock
    Bonefire Whisper
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    HG DCF Hex
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    Sheltowee JRB SS
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    Bonefire
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    2,337
    Quote Originally Posted by Shug View Post
    Though I have Dyneema tarps, I usually grab my silpoly or silnylon one for a trip.
    Tough to explain.
    Shug
    I'm new to DCF so it gets the call now...but I still feel like a traitor to my 12' Sil AHE Toxaway. It never failed me a single time.
    Signature suspended

  7. #27

    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Location
    Cary, NC
    Hammock
    Pick one?
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    Depends
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    Love some down
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    Beetle Buckles
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    345
    Quote Originally Posted by Shug View Post
    Though I have Dyneema tarps, I usually grab my silpoly or silnylon one for a trip.
    Tough to explain.
    Shug
    I'm the same way. I just like my superfly and usually take it. I did order another DCF tarp during the last sale just because I wanted a 12' camo tarp.

  8. #28
    Senior Member Shrewd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Location
    Northern Virginia
    Posts
    378
    I carried a HG dyneema hex for the entire AT and most of the PCT (I rented a bit in the desert) and neve had any issues.

    Towards the end of the PCT it started to delaminate but I consider that the life expectancy of dyneema.

  9. #29
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Location
    Pace, Fl
    Hammock
    11' SLD Trail Lair
    Tarp
    BCUSA 10x12
    Insulation
    LocoLibre DWR Down
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    Cin-Bkle Dyn-Str
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    161
    I have a new DCF Winter Haven still in the box. I unrolled it slightly, decided that I did not like it, and have promptly set it aside for my buddy to claim. His HG dcf tarp lasted three trips before the corner tore during a storm in the gorge. HG was quick to do a repair and did an excellent job according to my buddy (I have yet to see it). The tarp did well but it was the only tarp to sustain damage to the material on that trip. The 20D silpoly and urethane coated nylon 70D tarps did not tear even though some have years of use under their belts. From what I have witnessed I gather that what I have read from other members posts on here concerning dcf is very true. It can withstand pulling but not punctures very well and as with all things is a trade off. Often durability and puncture/tear resistance in a material comes with a price...weight and bulk. If you take care of dcf and keep lady luck from smiling on it then you are most likely going to get your money's worth out of it.

  10. #30
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    Watkinsville, GA
    Hammock
    Hammeck Netty, Astd. Dutch
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    HG DCF Hex, TF
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    HG,WLSS,JrB,UGQ,LL
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    LW straps/Becket
    Posts
    492
    I love the weight and water repellency of DCF but it is very susceptible to puncture. I have both the Palace and Hex DCF tarps and had to patch each of them the last time I took them out. I have no idea what caused the holes but just noticed them while I was laying in the hammock. That being said, the DCF patched wonderfully with DCF tape and is just as good as new once patched. Having said all that, unless it's going to be crazy weather, I'd rather take my Thunderfly than the Palace even though it weighs a touch more dry and a lot more wet. I just like the door configuration better. If any tarp maker would ever make a DCF version of the Thunderfly, I think they'd have all the business they could handle as that would the ideal tarp, IMO.

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