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  1. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by cougarmeat View Post
    Yah but … you know those videos where someone used a masonry pillar as an anchor for their hammock. …. who care’s about physics, just a bunch of rules.

    I guess the key here is Tpatter checked out his friend’s setup. I”m sure if he saw something “off” that would be dangerous, he would have said something. There is absolutely a wide road of setups and many times “the most efficient” isn’t the goal.
    For sure! I actually like the guy!

    We came around to talking adjustments hours later when he checked mine out. I then gave him the benefit of my limited experience. I’ve got 2 adult children (seems like an odd phase). I learned through experience that the horse will drink when it is ready no matter how much I may want to water it.

    Simple adjustments really - too much sag, head end too high, saggy tarp. Oh yeah, I think he had his shoes on as well. He’s now a convert and has a hammock of his own.

  2. #32
    cmoulder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tpatter View Post
    For sure! I actually like the guy!

    We came around to talking adjustments hours later when he checked mine out. I then gave him the benefit of my limited experience. I’ve got 2 adult children (seems like an odd phase). I learned through experience that the horse will drink when it is ready no matter how much I may want to water it.

    Simple adjustments really - too much sag, head end too high, saggy tarp. Oh yeah, I think he had his shoes on as well. He’s now a convert and has a hammock of his own.
    I really like that approach.

    I'm in a similar situation with a neighbor/friend who is very slowly getting into backpacking and hammocking. I'm going to try a very simple approach as I introduce him to both hammocks and backpacking, doing so only when weather is very amenable... basically no precip and light wind, short hike to a nice spot. Except for some clothing items, I have complete gear setup to outfit him properly.

    Just a couple of weeks ago I took along hammock/UQ on a local day hike and he got his first experience in a real hammock... I think he's hooked! But depending on the weather we might not be doing an actual overnighter until spring.
    Five Basic Principles of Going Lighter (not me... the great Cam Honan of OZ) Instagram (me!)

    To equip a pedestrian with shelter, bedding, utensils, food, and other necessities, in a pack so light and small that he can carry it without overstrain, is really a fine art. ~ Horace Kephart, 1906

  3. #33
    cougarmeat's Avatar
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    > I learned through experience that the horse will drink when it is ready no matter how much I may want to water it.

    One of the biggest surprises after taking a variety of first aid classes was the first time I was in a situation to use the knowledge, and times afterwards, those in need refused any assistance - something not covered in class.

    In class, we all took turns wrapping ankles and having our ankles wrapped - everyone cooperating. When I walked out to the car to go to work one day, and found my neighbor pinned under his motorcycle, I lifted it off him and offered to wrap his ankle and/or take him to a doctor. He said, Im fine and hopped on one foot back to his house.

    Another time, a xc skier went down as we were skiing back from an outing and slowed to the end of the group. I was sweep making sure everyone between the leader and myself got back safely. We offered to bring a snowmobile in to ferry her the last mile or so but she said she was fine. I was able to at least have her give me both her hip belt water bottles to take some weight off. When she got to the parking lot she drove her (stick shift) car home. Later she showed of with a cast because of her fractured ankle.

    If someone doesnt ask for help, they probably arent gonna hear it. But that doesnt mean it doesnt hurt to see them suffering.
    Last edited by cougarmeat; 12-02-2020 at 13:53.
    In order to see what few have seen, you must go where few have gone. And DO what few have done.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by cougarmeat View Post
    The thing about there rules is they arent random. Theyve been developed over years of trial and error. That doesnt mean they cant be improved upon - they came about by breaking a previous rule. But I think that before breaking a rule, a person should at least try it and understand how it came to be - not just ignore it because youre not the boss of me. It took many, many, many lessons in my work history where, new to a job, Id see lots of things people were doing wrong. But then, after a few months on the job, Id start to see why things were done the way they were. Often there were elements, important elements, I hadnt even considered.
    That's exactly right. Should definitely apply the rules first. The problem comes in when there is no understanding of the WHY behind it.

    You are also very right about the "because you are not the boss of me" part. A bad master will only insist on following the rules and never explain WHY they exist. Possibly because he himself does not understand. A good master will teach the apprentice the rules and if he has a curious apprentice, teach him the WHY. The best thing that can happen is to have an apprentice that asks the "5 WHY s" all the time. Unfortunately a lot of cultures don't appreciate this and kids are taught not to "ask so many questions". Of course it's ok to have apprentices that just always follow the rules, never inquire about anything and that's all they do. That's fine. Just don't make them a master/teacher

    I like shoes as examples. I'm thinking hundreds of years back when shoes were always proper welted leather shoes. Not cheap glued factory made stuff. Let's apply the above situation of master and apprentice there. Now imagine a shoemaker with an apprentice in England and another one in Germany. There's the English welting technique taught in England. There's also a German welting technique. Both work well to hold a shoe together, make it repairable etc. Now imagine in which environment it might have been possible for an apprentice to come up with the respective other technique. They are both perfectly good techniques for proper shoe construction but without "breaking the rules" of English shoe construction you would never arrive at the other way of doing it or vice versa.

    Coming back to hammocks one might apply this to the 83% ridge line or the 30* hang angle. I will follow this first. Then I will experiment and if I don't know why 30* is the rule I might try angles that put so much stress on the setup that it breaks. If I know the WHY though - of the forces being applied to all these triangles I know 30 or 31 or 29 really doesn't matter at all but some other angles I really never want to get to.

  5. #35
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    Yesterday I received my Dutch Chameleon Wide in 1.7 NylonD that I ordered during Dutch's Black Friday sale, so today I headed out to my "hammock laboratory" to set it up. I thought I would post pics on my setup process and talk a little about the hammock.

    IMG_0029.jpeg
    I chose a span exactly 15 feet wide (I measured), here is my initial set. I attached the foot end around 1.5 feet above my head and the head end around a foot over, I'm 6'1", 210 lbs. I center and guess on the right hight, when sitting in the hammock, I like my calves to be level with the ground. I don't give a crap about the angle of the straps, the height that the straps need to be on the tree and all that other formula BS.
    IMG_0030.jpeg
    Next I look at the ridgeline. This looks just about right, it's not too tight nor too loose. Note that I swapped out the Dutch gray ridgeline for bright yellow one.
    IMG_0017.jpeg
    Inside the hammock, the ridgeline tightened up nicely.
    IMG_0026.jpeg
    However, you don't want the ridgeline to be too tight. you should be able to bend in between your fingers, like I can here. That's it, done. My first setup took, at most, five minutes.
    IMG_0028.jpeg
    I wanted to try a wide hammock due to the fact that, although I get a comfortable lay with a standard width, it causes pressure on my feet that, after a day of hiking, can cause discomfort through the night. If you look at the pic above, my feet are barely touching the end of the hammock, no pressure whatsoever. I think this is gonna work!

  6. #36
    cmoulder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rex Clifton View Post
    Yesterday I received my Dutch Chameleon Wide in 1.7 NylonD that I ordered during Dutch's Black Friday sale, so today I headed out to my "hammock laboratory" to set it up. I thought I would post pics on my setup process and talk a little about the hammock.

    IMG_0029.jpeg
    I chose a span exactly 15 feet wide (I measured), here is my initial set. I attached the foot end around 1.5 feet above my head and the head end around a foot over, I'm 6'1", 210 lbs. I center and guess on the right hight, when sitting in the hammock, I like my calves to be level with the ground. I don't give a crap about the angle of the straps, the height that the straps need to be on the tree and all that other formula BS.
    IMG_0030.jpeg
    Next I look at the ridgeline. This looks just about right, it's not too tight nor too loose. Note that I swapped out the Dutch gray ridgeline for bright yellow one.
    IMG_0017.jpeg
    Inside the hammock, the ridgeline tightened up nicely.
    IMG_0026.jpeg
    However, you don't want the ridgeline to be too tight. you should be able to bend in between your fingers, like I can here. That's it, done. My first setup took, at most, five minutes.
    IMG_0028.jpeg
    I wanted to try a wide hammock due to the fact that, although I get a comfortable lay with a standard width, it causes pressure on my feet that, after a day of hiking, can cause discomfort through the night. If you look at the pic above, my feet are barely touching the end of the hammock, no pressure whatsoever. I think this is gonna work!
    Looks darn comfy!
    Five Basic Principles of Going Lighter (not me... the great Cam Honan of OZ) Instagram (me!)

    To equip a pedestrian with shelter, bedding, utensils, food, and other necessities, in a pack so light and small that he can carry it without overstrain, is really a fine art. ~ Horace Kephart, 1906

  7. #37
    Member Pop_Eye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rex Clifton View Post
    Yesterday I received my Dutch Chameleon Wide in 1.7 NylonD that I ordered during Dutch's Black Friday sale, so today I headed out to my "hammock laboratory" to set it up. I thought I would post pics on my setup process and talk a little about the hammock.

    IMG_0029.jpeg
    I chose a span exactly 15 feet wide (I measured), here is my initial set. I attached the foot end around 1.5 feet above my head and the head end around a foot over, I'm 6'1", 210 lbs. I center and guess on the right hight, when sitting in the hammock, I like my calves to be level with the ground. I don't give a crap about the angle of the straps, the height that the straps need to be on the tree and all that other formula BS.
    IMG_0030.jpeg
    Next I look at the ridgeline. This looks just about right, it's not too tight nor too loose. Note that I swapped out the Dutch gray ridgeline for bright yellow one.
    IMG_0017.jpeg
    Inside the hammock, the ridgeline tightened up nicely.
    IMG_0026.jpeg
    However, you don't want the ridgeline to be too tight. you should be able to bend in between your fingers, like I can here. That's it, done. My first setup took, at most, five minutes.
    IMG_0028.jpeg
    I wanted to try a wide hammock due to the fact that, although I get a comfortable lay with a standard width, it causes pressure on my feet that, after a day of hiking, can cause discomfort through the night. If you look at the pic above, my feet are barely touching the end of the hammock, no pressure whatsoever. I think this is gonna work!

    Purdy hang.

    How long have you been doing this? A few years maybe?

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pop_Eye View Post
    Purdy hang.

    How long have you been doing this? A few years maybe?
    Around six years. When I started, I drove myself crazy with all the formula stuff. Don't get me wrong, all that makes sense, it's just that math makes my head spin!

  9. #39
    cmoulder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rex Clifton View Post
    Around six years. When I started, I drove myself crazy with all the formula stuff. Don't get me wrong, all that makes sense, it's just that math makes my head spin!
    Lol I darn near bought the hangle bubble-level thingie early on.
    Five Basic Principles of Going Lighter (not me... the great Cam Honan of OZ) Instagram (me!)

    To equip a pedestrian with shelter, bedding, utensils, food, and other necessities, in a pack so light and small that he can carry it without overstrain, is really a fine art. ~ Horace Kephart, 1906

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