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  1. #31

    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Selma, NC
    Hammock
    Warbonnet, Eldorado & Ridgerunner
    Tarp
    WB Cloudburst
    Insulation
    Therm Ridgerest
    Suspension
    webbing/buckles
    Posts
    102
    I'd like to take the time to disagree with most of what has been written here in favor of underquilts, as the suppositions made don't take one huge factor into consideration. The learning curve of a Hammock and where you are on that curve.
    If you are considering this set of choices you are just starting out and there are many things you will slowly learn over time. But the question is being put to a highly enthusiastic and experience audience. Many here are experts. Some forget or discount the impact of their earliest days hanging.

    I think it is an excellent choice to buy your first hammock in a double layer first of all, and one that is designed for the option of a mat between the layers. It opens up choices, it can mitigate problems. I've now been to five state parks where they told me "no hammocks" (looking at you state of Virginia and especially Florida) A pad and tiny tent saved the day, though there was nothing comfortable about it. Given the choice between sleeping on a mat under a tart or sleeping on hard ground - a mat is disaster relief of sorts.

    Some people prefer double layer for insects, though I personally find single just as good and saving the last grams of weight is also a specialized approach, that takes dedication and experience to do well. Perhaps you will do all sorts of camping instead of long hikes, and may find (like myself) that weight savings is low on the list of priorities, far below reliability. Nobody has ever been stopped by extra weight. It's simply a nice thing to get into if that's your sort of thing. People have frequently been stopped by equiptment failure.

    So start with the double layer and what you already have. After a while you will know more about hammocking in general and start to gear up according to your particular preferences, born of personal experience. You will know better for example if you are a warm or cold sleeper, and maybe save some money by getting the right gear the first time around.

    And the best part will be at some point down the line, which each of us reach differently. That day, after your first trip with an underquilt, where you get to say "why on earth did I wait so long!.

    It's a yourney. Skipping steps can be expensive.

  2. #32
    Rolloff's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Leveland
    Hammock
    Bonefire Whisper
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    HG DCF Hex
    Insulation
    Sheltowee JRB SS
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    Bonefire
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    2,447
    You get what you get at SPs. I never camp there. Horrible places for horrible people IMO. Sort of like a Zoo of another type.

    HF starter advice has always been to use what you have and just get out there. Use the pad you have, but don't go spend 100-200 dollars on the end all be all for a hammock pad unless you plan on getting most of it's use on the ground.

    The number of hangers that try an UQ and go back to their pads is about the same as the number in this thread.

    Which makes that basically the exception that proves the rule.

    It's always good to ask questions. It's up to you to decide who to listen to. You don't have to like what the answer may be. Most of all don't let any of it or anyone discourage you from simply getting out there HYOH.

    Pavel may be correct in assuming nobody has ever been stopped by weight, he's not, but do I know of several people who went UL just to extend their outdoors fun. I stopped backpacking because I was in an accident and my back simply wouldn't take all the hands and knees and crawling around on the ground, to set up and tear down. When I started with hammocks again, it was using kits that still flirted with 20lb+ and it was causing an old sciatica injury to keep flaring up at around 8-10 miles. UL put me back in the game for a third time and so far w/o pain.

    I am enjoying myself more. I don't have to cut trips short. I always disliked packing all that "stuff" back up fitting it in around the things that never came out of my pack, just to get back out on the trail every morning. I've gone from a full length 50-60lb pack in the winter to 20lb in shoulder season and now to just under 11lb. I've always enjoyed the journey but going UL and sleeping in a comfortable hammock every night in the woods is simply better than it ever was.

    Back to pads...I can't ever go back to a pad. It's not a question of insulation, or weight. For me it's simply volume. 14L does not allocate the room to carry one. I can remember the first time I barrel rolled a blue CCF pad and put it inside my Golite Pinnacle I could tell this wasn't going to work. Once I'd finished stuffing my synthetic SB inside the pad, there was simply no room left for anything else. It was a good thing. I learned to find gear that would fit my needs and in my pack.
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  3. #33
    hutzelbein's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Germany
    Hammock
    WBBB SL 1.7
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    WB Mamajamba
    Insulation
    WB 0° Wooki +3oz
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    Beetle Buckles
    Posts
    3,968
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    112
    Most beginners try to use a pad. I did so, too. The two main reasons are that pretty much everybody already owns a pad and a comparable underquilt is usually expensive, and there is always the worry of "what do I do if I cannot find two trees?"

    Generally, it's not wrong to try using what you already have. But the big question is, should you spend more money on a double layer GE hammock only to make your pad work? My advice would be don't.

    In my opinion, the only reasons to get a double layer GE hammock are because you either need the weight capacity or you prefer less stretch. If you only get it to make your pad work, you will be wasting your money. I have tried pads in pretty much all of my GE hammocks, and they only work well enough in short and narrow hammocks, because they cannot move (much). Plus they improve the lay because they prevent the squeeze on your shoulders. With all longer and wider hammocks, pads simply slip around too much. Unless you want to move it slightly into a better position -- then the pad seems to be glued to the spot.

    However, the OP wants to invest in a Dream Hammock, which is neither short nor narrow. The ENO hammock seems to have worked well for them, so stretch is not an issue. Hence the only reason to go double layer seems to be the wish to use a pad. In this case, I'd say save the extra money for an underquilt. Or, if it's necessary to go to ground frequently, get either a bridge hammock or a 90° hammock. Both work really well with pads.

  4. #34
    New Member rjc149's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    North Jersey
    Hammock
    Warbonnet Blackbird 1.7
    Tarp
    WB Super Fly
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    Z-Rest and Yeti
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    web 'n beener
    Posts
    21
    I started with a pad, went UQ (3/4) then went back to the pad. There are no cold spots within its coverage, it's not susceptible to insulation loss from wind, and I just find the structure and rigidity of pads more comfortable.

    I use a double-layer WWBB, which is designed for a pad. It keeps the pad in place, making the fiddle factor pretty low, and it puts an extra barrier between you and the condensation that develops on the pad overnight (if you use a Thermarest, condensation will collect in the divots, and the second layer of the hammock will keep it off of you).

  5. #35
    cmoulder's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    Ossining, NY
    Hammock
    DH Darien #6235, #7111
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    HG hex, hex w/door
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    Enigma, Incubator
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    Kevlar, Lapp Hitch
    Posts
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    324
    Quote Originally Posted by Rolloff View Post
    You get what you get at SPs. I never camp there. Horrible places for horrible people IMO. Sort of like a Zoo of another type.

    HF starter advice has always been to use what you have and just get out there. Use the pad you have, but don't go spend 100-200 dollars on the end all be all for a hammock pad unless you plan on getting most of it's use on the ground.

    The number of hangers that try an UQ and go back to their pads is about the same as the number in this thread.

    Which makes that basically the exception that proves the rule.

    It's always good to ask questions. It's up to you to decide who to listen to. You don't have to like what the answer may be. Most of all don't let any of it or anyone discourage you from simply getting out there HYOH.

    Pavel may be correct in assuming nobody has ever been stopped by weight, he's not, but do I know of several people who went UL just to extend their outdoors fun. I stopped backpacking because I was in an accident and my back simply wouldn't take all the hands and knees and crawling around on the ground, to set up and tear down. When I started with hammocks again, it was using kits that still flirted with 20lb+ and it was causing an old sciatica injury to keep flaring up at around 8-10 miles. UL put me back in the game for a third time and so far w/o pain.

    I am enjoying myself more. I don't have to cut trips short. I always disliked packing all that "stuff" back up fitting it in around the things that never came out of my pack, just to get back out on the trail every morning. I've gone from a full length 50-60lb pack in the winter to 20lb in shoulder season and now to just under 11lb. I've always enjoyed the journey but going UL and sleeping in a comfortable hammock every night in the woods is simply better than it ever was.

    Back to pads...I can't ever go back to a pad. It's not a question of insulation, or weight. For me it's simply volume. 14L does not allocate the room to carry one. I can remember the first time I barrel rolled a blue CCF pad and put it inside my Golite Pinnacle I could tell this wasn't going to work. Once I'd finished stuffing my synthetic SB inside the pad, there was simply no room left for anything else. It was a good thing. I learned to find gear that would fit my needs and in my pack.
    ^^^^This^^^

    'Tis me to a T.

    If I had to grunt and strain under ponderous loads I simply wouldn't be backpacking any more. Doing a long hike and overnight with full hammock kit and TPW of 12-13 lbs is sheer delight.
    Five Basic Principles of Going Lighter (not me... the great Cam Honan of OZ) Instagram (me!)

    “To equip a pedestrian with shelter, bedding, utensils, food, and other necessities, in a pack so light and small that he can carry it without overstrain, is really a fine art.” ~ Horace Kephart, 1906

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