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  1. #11
    cougarmeat's Avatar
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    Japandy, First look up NAMA Claw so you know what it looks like: https://www.namagear.com/product-page/nama-claws

    The ridgeline of a tarp can be finished in several ways. It could have a sewn on loop (webbing or nylon). It could have a plastic "ring" (D-shaped or triangle). It could have a very small, strong, split-ring.

    From here, when I mention ridgeline, I'm taking about the line suspending the tarp, not the ridgeline OF the tarp.

    The NAMA Claw - used in pairs - is slid on the tarp ridgeline line (usually 1.74mm or 2.2mm Zing-It or Lash-It) with the jaw opening facing out. When not under stress, the jaw pivots up and allows the claw to slide where you want it along the ridgeiine. When you attach the end of the tarp to the Jaw with stress, it pivots down and locks in place.

    You put whatever is at the tarps end in the small jaw opening. Any small cord loop would work, as would that small split ring I mentioned (Warbonnet uses them), But a plastic connection would probably be too big and you'd use a small cord loop from it to the jaw.

    All is fine while set up. But when the tarp is in a stuff sack or snakeskin, it is not under tension - it does not pull against the jaw. Because it can move around a little, somehow, amazingly, if no precautions are taken - that end connection (loop or small split ring) can come out of the jaw. So when you go to set the tarp up again, you have to fuss with that connection. It's a small thing. but it's an unnecessary fuss.

    I now use a small cord loop between the tarp's end split ring and the NAMA Claw jaw. That allows me to "tie" the end to the jaw so it doesn't slip out when stored away. I believe NAMA has now modified their Claw to minimize "escapes".

    To be clear, when I've been talking about the split-ring/NAMA Claw connection, I'm talking about the manufacturer's split-ring on the end of the tarp. I'm not talking about a weaker "hobby" split-ring I used as a "fuse" that would fail before the tarp was damaged.

    I used the "fuse" style setup when the tarp itself took part of the stress between the trees. In other words, in my earlier setups, the tarp didn't hang from the ridgeline, it was part of the ridgeline (see posts on Split Ridgeline).

    Note: A SnakeSkin is a sleeve some people use instead of a stuff-sack for storing the tarp. It's very handy when setting up in windy conditions because it allows you to expose and guy down, a portion of the tarp at a time - rather than having the whole thing flail about in the wind.
    Last edited by cougarmeat; 04-21-2024 at 11:52.
    In order to see what few have seen, you must go where few have gone. And DO what few have done.

  2. #12
    Senior Member
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    i've been suspicious of "weak guylines" and "fuses" as an idea for a long time, and keep harassing people here with "but why, really?" 's and such. It's not simple, but it seems to me that, for the most part, it is false security: when tarps rip at the tieout, it's because the tieout is trash (the usual crappy grommets for instance, i mean 100% of grommets solutions used on camping tarps, which are just there so that you can be sure where the rip will start, it seems); if the rip is in the tarp fabric somewhere, it's not simple to understand why it happened, and i doubt a fuse would have saved the day (it might have made it worse in some cases).

    guylines and ridgelines which are not completely static (so not dyneema) do have some merit in my opinion, to absorb very brief shocks, and allow for "reshaping the tarp" without using chisel, but (planning) failure is, i think, not a good option, or at best not worth bothering with, at least as far as can tell for now.

    in your case, although hard to be sure from the photos, it seems the rip is somewhere "in the middle" (not at the tieout). i'm even wondering if it wasn't caused by some projectile (like stick or piece of wood driven by the wind). even if the tear was started by a projectile, it seems to me that the extent of the tear suggests the tarp was "badly tensioned" (uneven tension); it's hard to tension a non-catenary tarp properly, but it's usually worth trying (and fun to learn, if you ask me, but i'm weird).

    if the tear happened because of uneven tension and a strong windgust, a "fuse" might have prevented the initial tear, but it would have allowed the tarp to take a different shape, and potentially cause a different kind of tear (hard to say if better or worse than this one). if you think about it, aside from somebody tripping on a guyline, fuses are just gambling, depending on how the wind is, and how the tarp is pitched, and what happens after the "guilty gust" (will there be an even bigger one? a few? steady strong wind for a while? sudden change of direction? etc), you might end up with a worse situation when one arbitrary tieout gives out. planning failure modes on a tarp in high winds is aerodynamic design and engineering, and yes, it is fun i agree, but it does not come down to "if the tieout/guyline fuse fails under load, then everything will be okay and the tarp will be saved", if you want a short statement, it's more along the lines "if the fuse fails, then everything will change, and all bets are off. good luck (note: perhaps best to step back and watch from a distance)"

    i'd say don't change your setup because of this event, consider verifying how evenly you tension your tarp, and aiming for more even tension (not more tension, but more even distribution); if you camp in "funny conditions" (high winds) a lot, then "we gotta talk aerodynamics", but before dragging you to kitesurfing school: even tension as much as possible, and ridgeline somewhat along the wind (perhaps not parallel, but not perpendicular) was already mentioned, although tarp perpendicular to the wind has the advantage it is quite predictable (annoying, but predictably so).

  3. #13
    Senior Member Cruiser51's Avatar
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    I use a rather large tarp (KitsapCowboys Batwing) for my bridge setup and when the wind gets going I always worried about something letting go. The original tie out are standard LineLoc 3s with Lawson Glow Wire, the top suspension is a standard 1" D ring and a "Zing It" Prussick on a "Zing It" ridge line.

    Hadn't really been happy with the ease of handling a standard tie out system, so when the "LineLoc Hook" was released .... I had an epiphany. Added 6" loops of 1/8" shock cord to each tie out and used the "Line Hook" to connect and disconnect the stakes/cord from the tarp fast and easy. Also added a loop of 3/16" shock cord to the ridgeline suspension, between the D ring and prussick, keeps the tarp tensioned and allows a little give when it blows hard.

    When the wind blows or some one stumbles past and catches a line, the shock cord adds some give and helps protect the tarp from tearing. Separating the lines from the tarp allows each stake/line to be stored/rolled separately to prevent tangling when setting up.

    This doesn't solve world problems, but using the Line Hook to add a flexible suspension is pretty easy and seems to prevent shock loads to the tarp. The bonus for me is the ease of connecting and disconnecting the stakes/guylines from the tarp ... just seems to make setup a lor easier.

  4. #14
    Senior Member Crazytown3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cruiser51 View Post
    I use a rather large tarp (KitsapCowboys Batwing) for my bridge setup and when the wind gets going I always worried about something letting go. The original tie out are standard LineLoc 3s with Lawson Glow Wire, the top suspension is a standard 1" D ring and a "Zing It" Prussick on a "Zing It" ridge line.

    Hadn't really been happy with the ease of handling a standard tie out system, so when the "LineLoc Hook" was released .... I had an epiphany. Added 6" loops of 1/8" shock cord to each tie out and used the "Line Hook" to connect and disconnect the stakes/cord from the tarp fast and easy. Also added a loop of 3/16" shock cord to the ridgeline suspension, between the D ring and prussick, keeps the tarp tensioned and allows a little give when it blows hard.

    When the wind blows or some one stumbles past and catches a line, the shock cord adds some give and helps protect the tarp from tearing. Separating the lines from the tarp allows each stake/line to be stored/rolled separately to prevent tangling when setting up.

    This doesn't solve world problems, but using the Line Hook to add a flexible suspension is pretty easy and seems to prevent shock loads to the tarp. The bonus for me is the ease of connecting and disconnecting the stakes/guylines from the tarp ... just seems to make setup a lor easier.
    This is exactly what I did with my big winter tarp too; lineloc hooks on a line fixed to the stake. I have two loops of cord on my tarp side tie outs, one shock cord, and one a little loop of 550 cord. I added both on one trip "for testing purposes", and have been too lazy and don't care enough to go back to one loop on each tie out. The lineloc hooks always stay attached to the stakes though. Super simple to deal with.

  5. #15
    Phantom Grappler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adroa View Post
    First time I have seen that stakeless setup suggested. You have any photos you could share? Any issues with the tarp riding up near the pole mods? With the warbonnet superly I noticed if I have the center pole mod in that section tends to be a bit higher. Can be really convenient when weather is decent and I want to be able to duck in and out but if a big wind came through I like to know I can tighten it down with the guyline.
    Iím sorry, not tech savvy, might have pictures or a video late this fall

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phantom Grappler View Post
    I’m sorry, not tech savvy, might have pictures or a video late this fall
    Would certainly be interesting to see!

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