"Base Weight" question ...

[Kukri]

It seems an awful lot like epeen syndrome to me when people start taking things off the list of what is weighed. Maybe just so they can get past that 5lb mark? Conversely, if one is going to weigh EVERYTHING, shouldn't any excess body mass be calculated as well so as to get a real idea of how much extra a person is carrying around?

I think it gets a little ridiculous sometimes with people just trying to 1up others. I'm glad people started to weigh things and I've definitely lightened my load because others get carried away, but I just go with what's comfortable. At mos, I will hop ob the bathroom scale to do a quick before and after with my pack full just before heading to the car.

[amac]

I started writing this up and then found a better reference that I like a lot: Mike Clelland from NOLS:

The Lightweight Lexicon

Base Weight: The weight of the pack itself and all the items carried in it that doesn’t change during the hike. Consumables are NOT included.

Consumables: Food, water, fuel, sunscreen and toiletries. Things that get used during the trip.

Pack Weight: Base weight plus consumables. The weight of the fully loaded pack at the trailhead. This does not include your shoes and hiking outfit.

Skin-out Weight: The weight of everything that is going in the field on the trip. Shoes, socks, underwear, watch, sunglasses - everything!

...

Traditional: Over 20 pound base weight; usually this means a pack weight of over 35 pounds.

Lightweight: Base weight below 20 pounds

Ultra-Light: Base weight below 10 pounds — this requires experience and dedication. With a little practice and a few specialized pieces of gear, this is actually pretty easy to achieve.

SUB-Ultra-Light: (a.k.a. Psycho-Light) Base weight below 5 pounds, the domain of an extreme fringe!

...

A conservative calculation:

13 lb. base weight + 12 lb. consumables = 25 pound LIGHT & FAST pack weight!

*Note: Consumables calculation, 6 day ration (x) 1.5 pounds of food per person per day (PPPD), food total 9 pounds, plus 3 fuel and water.

A good read with excellent drawings that illustrates this point: Lighten Up! Complete Ultralight Backpacking.

I agree with this as a set of formal, technical definitions, and think it is the best I've seen. Practically, however, I take a very simple approach of weighing. When I weigh my pack, I take my full food bad and full water bottles out of the pack, weigh it, and declare that number as my base weight. Then weigh the pack with food bag and water bottles, that's my pack weight. I realize that my "base weight" includes fuel and other consumables and fails to include the weight of the empty food bag and water bottles. But, it's close enough.

[TinaLouise]

I take a very simple approach of weighing. When I weigh my pack, I take my full food bad and full water bottles out of the pack, weigh it, and declare that number as my base weight. Then weigh the pack with food bag and water bottles, that's my pack weight. I realize that my "base weight" includes fuel and other consumables and fails to include the weight of the empty food bag and water bottles. But, it's close enough.

yep!!
that's what I do too. And if I pick up my "full" pack and it's to heavy, I go through it again and remove things until I can carry it. The first time I did this, I removed some of my water.... bad idea!!! Now I leave at home my luxery items. I've found that they're not a luxery if I'm to tired to use them. My thoughts are that... It doesn't matter what my pack is gonna weight in a few days after I've eatten my way through my food... I've got to be able to carry it on the first couple of days when it's at it's heavyest.

Hey, according to that list... I'm in the "lightweight" catagory

[kayak karl]

It seems an awful lot like epeen syndrome to me when people start taking things off the list of what is weighed. Maybe just so they can get past that 5lb mark? Conversely, if one is going to weigh EVERYTHING, shouldn't any excess body mass be calculated as well so as to get a real idea of how much extra a person is carrying around?

I think it gets a little ridiculous sometimes with people just trying to 1up others. I'm glad people started to weigh things and I've definitely lightened my load because others get carried away, but I just go with what's comfortable. At mos, I will hop ob the bathroom scale to do a quick before and after with my pack full just before heading to the car.

i agree. i think knowing weights is a need to know when upgrading gear, but there come a point where "it is what it is" and just hike

[Raul Perez]

I know a few people mentioned the FSO method. I understand the method but that is not my cup of tea.

Including the clothes I wear doesnt seem practical to me. The clothes I wear for work (especially if I'm in my suit) and around the house "weigh" more than what I wear on a hike in 3 season as I'm utilizing light weight synthetic material. Plus I carry my complete set of keys, pocket knife, and a Costanza wallet. My body is used to carrying that on a daily basis. I do not carry those items (except pocket knife) when I hike but my boots and socks weight a bit more. I believe losing my wallet and keys and the weight of my "normal" clothes cancels out the increased weight of my boots and socks (which aren't even that heavy to begin with).

This is why I keep my base weight restricted to the items within or attached to my pack as that is the focal point of the weight my body is not used to carrying on a daily basis.

[G.L.P.]

I started writing this up and then found a better reference that I like a lot: Mike Clelland from NOLS:

The Lightweight Lexicon

Base Weight: The weight of the pack itself and all the items carried in it that doesn’t change during the hike. Consumables are NOT included.

Consumables: Food, water, fuel, sunscreen and toiletries. Things that get used during the trip.

Pack Weight: Base weight plus consumables. The weight of the fully loaded pack at the trailhead. This does not include your shoes and hiking outfit.

Skin-out Weight: The weight of everything that is going in the field on the trip. Shoes, socks, underwear, watch, sunglasses - everything!

...

Traditional: Over 20 pound base weight; usually this means a pack weight of over 35 pounds.

Lightweight: Base weight below 20 pounds

Ultra-Light: Base weight below 10 pounds — this requires experience and dedication. With a little practice and a few specialized pieces of gear, this is actually pretty easy to achieve.

SUB-Ultra-Light: (a.k.a. Psycho-Light) Base weight below 5 pounds, the domain of an extreme fringe!

...

A conservative calculation:

13 lb. base weight + 12 lb. consumables = 25 pound LIGHT & FAST pack weight!

*Note: Consumables calculation, 6 day ration (x) 1.5 pounds of food per person per day (PPPD), food total 9 pounds, plus 3 fuel and water.

A good read with excellent drawings that illustrates this point: Lighten Up! Complete Ultralight Backpacking.

the best post i seen all week.....

[Just Jeff]

All items that are not consumable... food, water, fuel are not calculated in my base weight.

But their containers are. Food bag, water bottle, etc.

[Raul Perez]

But their containers are. Food bag, water bottle, etc.

Yes I include the container weight. Sorry I was not explicit about that.

[Just Jeff]

Kukri - it often does amount to one-ups-manship for many folks. Once you get to a comfortable weight, it's about the challenge. For some, it's the competition to beat others. For me, it's the competition against myself...the challenge to get my personal kit lower in a logical, safe manner. It's like putting together a puzzle with an unlimited number of pieces. And the challenge to see how little it takes to keep me comfortable in the woods. I've applied lessons learned from reducing my packweight to my life in general...realizing that time and experiences make me happier than pieces of things.

Neither one is right or wrong...I think competition among people is healthy. I just choose not to engage in this particular competition with other people.

I reduced my packweight until I found my comfortweight (which is copyrighted by Reality at PBF). I've been there for a while with a base weight around 10 lbs.

I've been thinking about challenging myself to a trip with 5 lbs base, though. Might do a quick overnighter up Eagles Peak. I'll need a 20F kit for that, which is a bit beyond the "normal trips" with 5 lbs bases.

[Just Jeff]

Yes I include the container weight. Sorry I was not explicit about that.

I figured you did. I just thought it was worth pointing out to others.

I guess it only matters if you're anal about it, though! People like us who have spreadsheets and stuff...