Tarp and a few ?

**mugs** · 10-01-2010, 21:58

First off to maintain HF etiquette when it comes to specific topics should I post in that said category? I.E. my next questions will be about tarps, so do I post in the tarp specific (MacCat etc) forum or do I just keep it here in general. Just wanting to know the proper way of doing things around here

OK on to the questions.

I just bought the MacCat standard I wanted to go with the smaller one but I wanted some over hang on the ends of the hammock to keep rain off. Or does the hammock sag a bit, is no longer 120in long when I get in it? I ruled on the side caution and got the standard which is 5in longer then the hammock itself. Personally I think the tarp looks a little too big for my taste but I will not know until I get it here at the house.

I noticed most of you guys use MSR ground hog stakes or equivalent to stake out things. Is this just because of the increased vulnerability of the hammock and tarp lines getting pulled out of the ground, or is just cause' that's what you guys use?

I use Ti shepherds hook stakes and would like to continue to do so if I can. Just for the mere weight saving of them (I am already sort of turning in my stomach about the weights of the whole hammock thing as is.) Or do I need to dig out the MSR that have seen the dirt in 4 years?

I am sure by the 2nd or 3rd time out I will be trying to figure out how to cut weight. I have been reading about some of your all's UL hammock systems will need to continue to do so. But I can see myself going that way real quick.

Thanks in advance

**Wags** · 10-01-2010, 23:31

i'd post any general tarp Q here. something specifically for OES i'd post in the OES part.

i also think you'll find the standard to be an excellent size balance of coverage and light weight...

i use a variety of stake. sometimes i take those shepherd hooks you have, and they work fine. if the soil is really soft, i simply put a heavy log or rock on top of the stake...

**Dutch** · 10-02-2010, 06:12

I almost always use Ti stakes. Only exception is if I am not hiking far and the one time I went to desert. The standard is a great tarp, you can go smaller of course. You can also go lighter if you wish, there are several people making cuben tarps now. With the OES standard though I think it is a balance of weight, coverage and $$$$. You should still be able to have a base weight of around 10 or 12 in the summer.

**Young hanger** · 10-02-2010, 06:31

i just ordered a micro because it was only 80$ shipped to Ireland

**TinaLouise** · 10-02-2010, 06:55

Originally Posted by mugs

I just bought the MacCat standard I wanted to go with the smaller one but I wanted some over hang on the ends of the hammock to keep rain off. Or does the hammock sag a bit, is no longer 120in long when I get in it? I ruled on the side caution and got the standard which is 5in longer then the hammock itself. Personally I think the tarp looks a little too big for my taste but I will not know until I get it here at the house.

I noticed most of you guys use MSR ground hog stakes or equivalent

I use Ti shepherds hook stakes and would like to continue

I am sure by the 2nd or 3rd time out I will be trying to figure out how to cut weight.

Thanks in advance

I too am interrested in hearing the answer to your question of "does the 120" ridgeline sag and therefore become shorter end to end for the tarp or if it stays relatively the same and you need a tarp who's ridgeline is even longer.

I use a combo of stakes. I've found all kinds of different types of soil when I'm backpacking and will end up needing one kind or another. I carry a couple of Ti shepherds hooks, a couple of msr needles and 4 ground hogs. I've had times that the ground hogs were the only thing that would hold and times when the only thing I could get in the ground was the Ti shepherd hooks.

Practice with your gear at home if you can, before a trip. If not then you'll need to bring a bit extra when you're out camping for the first few times until you've figured out what works for you. Until then, don't lighten up your pack to much, especially if going into colder weather.

TinaLouise

**Festus Hagen** · 10-02-2010, 07:30

I think the question was (re-stated a little bit)... if I have a tarp with a 10' ridgeline, and a hammock that is 10' long, will the tarp cover it adequately since a tarp ridgeline is pitched tight and pretty much flat, while a hammock is designed to sag thus the "effective length" is shorter and the answer is YES.

There is a formula out there stating that a structural ridgeline should be roughly 83% the length of the fabric of a hammock. To me that means that a 10' hammock "loses" almost two feet of overall length when hung with sag. Not sure how long your hammock actually IS but I'm betting you'll have close to one foot tarp overhang on each end of the hammock.

**Festus Hagen** · 10-02-2010, 07:40

Oh, and I use DAC V-stakes... I think they are similar if not the same as the ones the hammockforums store sells. I think in weight they are somewhere between the MSR Ground Hog and a Titanium shepherd's hook. I generally only carry two though, and I reason that they have more surface area to grab the ground with than a thin hook.

**Oxblood** · 10-03-2010, 12:09

Mugs,

For tarp hanging options, I would recommend going to whoopieslings.com. They have two types of tarp suspension kit. I use the two piece kit, and I am very happy with it. I use a Hennessy Silnylon Hex Tarp, and with the whoopieslings.com suspension kit, I have had no issues with the ridgeline. In fact, most sag will likely occur not on the ridge, but along the main surface on either side. This is where tensioners come in. A simple one is to clove hitch a length of shock cord to your guy lines to take p slack if it occurs.

**mugs** · 10-03-2010, 12:35

Originally Posted by Dutch

You should still be able to have a base weight of around 10 or 12 in the summer.

A base weight of 10-12 pounds not on my watch mister. Just merely going off of my already known weights I don't think I will be that high from the start.

Base Weight A: MY U.L Kit = 4.8 pounds and that's everything save food, fuel, water. (but those containers are included.)

Base Weight B: My L.W. Kit = 6.5 and that because the 4 ounce 6x9 cuben tarp is replaced with my Luner Solo.

So according to Warbonnet the WBBB 1.0 DL with suspension weighs 28.8 ounces and the MacCat standard weighs 10.2 ounces.

So if you take 4.8 - 4 (for the cuben tarp) and the 10 ounces of my MB UL Torso pad you end up with 3.92 ish now add the 39 ounces

for the hammock system to that, my base weight comes to 6.35 pounds which is livable.

But believe you me I don't like that 2+ pounds for a shelter system. But then again if I get the best sleep of my life and have total ease of set up any where I might stick with it. Nah....I know me, I will be trying to cut weight some how.

**beep** · 10-03-2010, 12:47

If you want to minimize weight, get the WBBB with the line/strap suspension, or, convert to whoopie slings. The line/strap combo is the lightest though a bit less easy to adjust (you have to retie the knots to adjust). Whoopie slings have the advantage of no knots (no derating of the rope) with easy adjustability.

For the 2-3 oz weight penalty of the all strap suspension, you get a very simple, no hassle suspension. If I were going with straps, I'd add Dutch Clips (from JRB).

For a very lightweight hammock kit, check out Sgt. Rock's post HERE