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  1. #1
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    Inverting Prusik for Better Hold

    Hadn't run across this in the couple hundred posts I'd read yet, so wasn't sure if it was known. I picked up this trick from my stunt kite flying days where we Prusik our control line attachment points to the kite's bridle. If you take a Prusik knot and roll it over, it forms a more grippy knot (at least, that's us kite fliers' opinon) that won't slide. You can easily roll/unroll to lock/slide the knot. Pics follow:

    (Click for larger)
    Unlocked for moving


    Locked


    ~Dan

  2. #2
    Senior Member desmobob's Avatar
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    Interesting....

    For a lot (most?) hammocking applications, it seems a sliding/gripping knot needs to hold force against one direction only. The Klemheist is better at that than the Prusik, and just as easy to tie and use. http://www.animatedknots.com/klemhei...matedknots.com

    Also, an extra wrap in the Prusik will help it grip better.

    Happy napping,
    desmobob

  3. #3
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    Yes, I've been debating Prusik vs. Klemheist. One thing I've discovered, however, is the line you use for a Klemheist needs to be smaller than the line you are attaching to. My experiments with a Prusik show that it does not need that requirement. A paracord Prusik on a paracord line holds just fine. A paracord Klemheist on a paracord line doesn't hold well for me at all. However, a utility line Klemheist on a paracord line holds great!

    I should also add that what I showed with rolling the Prusik won't work if the line you attach to is pulled taut. That would have the effect of unrolling the Prusik and unlocking it, which is actually the way I usually unlock the Prusik, by pulling both ends of the line it's attached to. However, this works great for a tarp setup where you are using independent lines for each side, not a single line setup, since one side of the line you attach to is slack. Also for tent guylines like the ones Opie sells.

    ~Dan

  4. #4
    Senior Member desmobob's Avatar
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    I've never tried same-size Prusik and line combinations. I've always been under the impression that a Prusik loop needs to be of smaller diameter line to work properly. The fact that it will work on similarly sized small line is handy to know.

    There is some great, solid info on knots in Mountaineering, Freedom of the Hills by The Mountaineers. That's where I got my information on Prusiks, Klemheists, and lots of others. Since these are climbing knots, the information assumes they will be used in large line and cord for climbing. I guess knot performance can differ on differing size line....

    Happy napping,
    desmobob

  5. #5
    Senior Member Nojack's Avatar
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    I was also looking into the fact that the regular prusik would occassionally slip on my amsteel and others had suggested the Klemheist on this thread:

    http://www.hammockforums.net/forum/s...ad.php?t=22860

    I was practicing last night with paracord and found that the not does not slip at all when pulled in the correct direction. Same size line and the prusik normally would unwrap until tension was applied once again. I believe I will be able to use any size cord using the Klemheist.

  6. #6
    Bubba's Avatar
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    I can probaby use your inverting tip somewhere. Thanks a lot.

  7. #7
    Senior Member lizzie's Avatar
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    Huh? Inverted? I'll have to try that!

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nojack View Post
    I was practicing last night with paracord and found that the not does not slip at all when pulled in the correct direction. Same size line and the prusik normally would unwrap until tension was applied once again. I believe I will be able to use any size cord using the Klemheist.
    Interesting. I wonder if the fact one of the ends of the line I attached to was slack had anything to do with my results? Unlike with the smaller diameter utility line, I also found my paracord Klemheist would not stay nicely coiled on the paracord line I attached it to. Admittedly, that was the first time I attempted the Klemheist and the utility line version the second time, so it might also be a matter of not setting it properly. I have read online (it's on the Internet, so it must be true, right?) that a proper Klemheist can only be tied if the line for the Klemheist is smaller than the line it is being attached to (see "Rope Size" comment here http://www.animatedknots.com/klemheist/index.php). Practice may show otherwise.

    ~Dan

  9. #9
    Senior Member Nojack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DannyBoy2k View Post
    Interesting. I wonder if the fact one of the ends of the line I attached to was slack had anything to do with my results? Unlike with the smaller diameter utility line, I also found my paracord Klemheist would not stay nicely coiled on the paracord line I attached it to. Admittedly, that was the first time I attempted the Klemheist and the utility line version the second time, so it might also be a matter of not setting it properly. I have read online (it's on the Internet, so it must be true, right?) that a proper Klemheist can only be tied if the line for the Klemheist is smaller than the line it is being attached to (see "Rope Size" comment here http://www.animatedknots.com/klemheist/index.php). Practice may show otherwise.

    ~Dan
    I am very new to all the knot tying techniques, but I was demonstrating the new knot to my wife and we both noticed that the Klemheist was, in fact, better than a regular prusik. I was only practicing the knot and pulling on it...not implementing the knot on a working load. With that in mind, I am always willing to try new innovative ways to hang and I will give your inversion idea that same respect.

    Thanks for posting

  10. #10
    Senior Member TiredFeet's Avatar
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    Okay, but if the main line is under a lot of tension (maybe even moderate tension?), then how do you get the kink in the main line to "invert" the Prussic?

    Also, if the main line isn't under tension when you "invert" the Prussic, does the kink remain or disappear when tension is put on the main line?

    If the kink disappears with tension on the main line, you're back to a regular Prussic.

    The only place where I use Prussics is where the main line is under moderate or higher tension and it seems that getting the kink in the first place and getting it to stay there would be difficult.

    So I assume that your main line isn't tensioned. Correct?

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