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  1. #51
    canoebie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knotty View Post
    canoebie - Those results are amazing. With that kind of temp inside the IX overcover it makes sense that you were condensation free.
    Yup, the real test will be the single digits. I think the key is to find a way to effectively ventilate without so much draft as to lose any effectiveness of the insulation. Even a "mesh like" material on the head end over and above the bug net would provide some ventilation. Testing continues, but so far, I am impressed. I think I am going to have a winter hang, and want to be prepared for serious cold my DIY way until I can afford a serious UQ or TQ from one of the fine folks here. Thirty degrees difference is significant. But then I gotta remember, my wife always tells me that I am "hot." Yeah, right.
    Revolution is about the need to re-evolve political, economic and social justice and power back into the hands of the people, preferably through legislation and policies that make human sense. That's what revolution is about. Revolution is not about shootouts.

    Bobby Seale


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  2. #52
    Knotty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by canoebie View Post
    ...Thirty degrees difference is significant. But then I gotta remember, my wife always tells me that I am "hot." Yeah, right.
    She must be right. After all, you're head does look like it's on fire in you avatar.
    Knotty
    "Don't speak unless it improves the silence." -proverb
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  3. #53
    canoebie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knotty View Post
    She must be right. After all, you're head does look like it's on fire in you avatar.
    Totally unrelated to the thread, that avatar is a flag my wife made for me. She says it is a portrayal of the "pirate" in me and it reminds her of me when I paddle my canoe. Argggg. I like to hang it with my hammock at a hang, it is recognized.
    Revolution is about the need to re-evolve political, economic and social justice and power back into the hands of the people, preferably through legislation and policies that make human sense. That's what revolution is about. Revolution is not about shootouts.

    Bobby Seale


    http://www.riverjourneys.org

  4. #54
    MarshLaw303's Avatar
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    would some 1.1dwr be enough to allow venting? if you had areas at the head and foot with no insulation but just some dwr would that move enough moisture while still keeping the drafts down?

    -Tim

  5. #55
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarshLaw303 View Post
    would some 1.1dwr be enough to allow venting? if you had areas at the head and foot with no insulation but just some dwr would that move enough moisture while still keeping the drafts down?

    -Tim
    Maybe. And it is being counted on in the shells of UQs and TQS and sleeping bags. But again, I remember when certain manufacturers ( probably when defending not using WPB shells on bags) warned that condensation could occur before the vapor ever touched the WPB ( or just breathable) shell.

    I've got a test I want to run that might be really useful for this discussion. More about it later.
    For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory that is to be revealed to us....that the creation itself also will be set free from its slavery to corruption into the freedom of the glory of the children of God. For we know that the whole creation groans and suffers the pains of childbirth together until now.
    Romans 8:18,21-22

  6. #56
    Knotty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarshLaw303 View Post
    would some 1.1dwr be enough to allow venting? if you had areas at the head and foot with no insulation but just some dwr would that move enough moisture while still keeping the drafts down?

    -Tim
    If you look at a Hennessy overcover it has a round hole to one side of the ridgeline near the head. Gotta guess that Tom felt not having a vent would be a problem. From the Hennessy web site:

    "The OverCover is uncoated 30D nylon with a breathing hole which fits over the mosquito net. It is intended to maintain warmer temperatures inside the shelter during dry, sub-freezing conditions."
    Knotty
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  7. #57
    MacEntyre's Avatar
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    The Molly Mac Gear IX Hammock Sock with SEEP covers the entire top of the hammock with breathable 1.1 nylon... and it requires venting in most conditions. I would not expect a small patch of breathable material to provide enough ventilation. Your breath pumps a lot of moisture into the air!
    "We must, indeed, all hang together or, most assuredly, we shall all hang separately." - Ben Franklin
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  8. #58
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knotty View Post
    If you look at a Hennessy overcover it has a round hole to one side of the ridgeline near the head. Gotta guess that Tom felt not having a vent would be a problem. From the Hennessy web site:

    "The OverCover is uncoated 30D nylon with a breathing hole which fits over the mosquito net. It is intended to maintain warmer temperatures inside the shelter during dry, sub-freezing conditions."
    Quote Originally Posted by MacEntyre View Post
    The Molly Mac Gear IX Hammock Sock with SEEP covers the entire top of the hammock with breathable 1.1 nylon... and it requires venting in most conditions. I would not expect a small patch of breathable material to provide enough ventilation. Your breath pumps a lot of moisture into the air!
    For another mystery (at least to me), there is the Speer PeaPod when mostly or all closed up. I have never understood why I don't get more ( or even some noticeable) condensation with the pod. When sleeping at cold temps with just a very small breathing hole. Or, occasionally for the last and coldest hours of the night, with the thing completely closed. At temps from 10 to 30*F.

    Now wouldn't you think that would just swamp me with condensation? Every time I chose to close her up all the way, it made me quite nervous, especially when I was in the Wilderness and not just the backyard. But so far I have got away with it every time.

    The closest I had to condensation was, while sleeping on my back with a little breathing opening right above my face, my breath vapor would apparently rise and exit the opening, freeze and fall back on my face waking me up. Plus another time in the Rockies at ~30F, while side sleeping and with the tarp pitched steeply to block wind/rain, the pod came in contact with the tarp right at face level. Condensation occurred on the tarp and soaked a small part of the pod that was touching the tarp.

    It just seems like I would get condensation doing that, even when using a very small opening. Conversely, while sleeping with warm clothing and my Golight 20 quilt tucked around my chin( in a BMBH with MW4), at ~10F, the top few inches of the quilt just got soaked with condensation. It couldn't have been any wetter if I had poured a cup of water on it. ( the Pertex Endurance shell in that area seemed to keep most of the water on the outside, but still)
    For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory that is to be revealed to us....that the creation itself also will be set free from its slavery to corruption into the freedom of the glory of the children of God. For we know that the whole creation groans and suffers the pains of childbirth together until now.
    Romans 8:18,21-22

  9. #59
    MAD777's Avatar
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    I believe that in the case of the PeaPod, it is too warm inside for condensation to occur. But, it certainly occurred before reaching the 10 degree outside temp. Therefore, the condensation occurred inside the down. (where it also froze into ice crystals).

    However, this is true of all breathable sleeping bags/quilts. Hence, long distance hikers in cold weather many times prefer synthetic insulation if the weather won't allow the thawing/drying of their bags.

    For overnighters or even weekends, it doesn't become an issue.

  10. #60
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MAD777 View Post
    I believe that in the case of the PeaPod, it is too warm inside for condensation to occur. But, it certainly occurred before reaching the 10 degree outside temp. Therefore, the condensation occurred inside the down. (where it also froze into ice crystals).

    However, this is true of all breathable sleeping bags/quilts. Hence, long distance hikers in cold weather many times prefer synthetic insulation if the weather won't allow the thawing/drying of their bags.

    For overnighters or even weekends, it doesn't become an issue.
    But that's the the thing, it Did not appear to condense at all, neither inside the Peapod nor in the down, not even near the shell. There was no percievable moisture or loft loss. I think I even weighed it once and the weight was pretty much unchanged.

    Now I'm sure there was actually some small amount of condensation, just not enough for me to percieve. Still, I would have expected a good bit of condensation.
    For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory that is to be revealed to us....that the creation itself also will be set free from its slavery to corruption into the freedom of the glory of the children of God. For we know that the whole creation groans and suffers the pains of childbirth together until now.
    Romans 8:18,21-22

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