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  1. #41
    Senior Member canoeski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BillyBob58 View Post
    It will be interesting to see those results!
    OK, here's the results:

    JRB High Sierra Sniveler TQ with Granite Gear stuff sack-
    wet= 2# 6.3 oz
    dry= 2# 3.1 oz for a water weight of 3.2 oz.

    JRB Mt Washington 4 UQ with Granite Gear stuff sack-
    wet= 2# 2.2 oz
    dry= 2# 0.6 oz for a water weight of 1.6 oz

    JRB down hood-
    wet= 2.8 oz
    dry= 2.5 oz for water weight of 0.3 oz (but it felt very damp)

    (weights for the MolyMac IX Baby Orca pending)

    I expected the TQ to have more moisture than the UQ because of the mylar protection underneath, and more importantly, warm moist air rises.

    Now, both quilts were used for 3 nights, and a thin Mylar space blanket was used above the MW4 UQ (but below the Baby Orca and WB Balckbird hammock). The second night at -10°F was the wettest for the TQ with frost everywhere, but I had a chance to partially dry it out in the sun for about 4 hours. They are designed very well with a black interior to absorb sunlight. It felt dry and warm for the 3rd night at -14°. I felt a little cool by morning, but not enough to get or do anything about it (I was able to sleep until 8:30 or 9)
    Not all who wander are lost.

  2. #42
    Señor Member wisenber's Avatar
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    I see Mac crafted a knee pad solution for the wet knee issues he had at Roan Mountain last month.

  3. #43
    Señor Member wisenber's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by canoeski View Post
    OK, here's the results:

    JRB High Sierra Sniveler TQ with Granite Gear stuff sack-
    wet= 2# 6.3 oz
    dry= 2# 3.1 oz for a water weight of 3.2 oz.

    JRB Mt Washington 4 UQ with Granite Gear stuff sack-
    wet= 2# 2.2 oz
    dry= 2# 0.6 oz for a water weight of 1.6 oz

    JRB down hood-
    wet= 2.8 oz
    dry= 2.5 oz for water weight of 0.3 oz (but it felt very damp)

    (weights for the MolyMac IX Baby Orca pending)

    I expected the TQ to have more moisture than the UQ because of the mylar protection underneath, and more importantly, warm moist air rises.

    Now, both quilts were used for 3 nights, and a thin Mylar space blanket was used above the MW4 UQ (but below the Baby Orca and WB Balckbird hammock). The second night at -10°F was the wettest for the TQ with frost everywhere, but I had a chance to partially dry it out in the sun for about 4 hours. They are designed very well with a black interior to absorb sunlight. It felt dry and warm for the 3rd night at -14°. I felt a little cool by morning, but not enough to get or do anything about it (I was able to sleep until 8:30 or 9)
    Thanks for those results. I figured the Mylar would keep the bottom from getting wet from perspiration. At those temps, the air is probably pretty dry.

    I was surprised to see the weight of the Sniveller. The dry weight would either mean that JRB is pretty far off on their weights or that Granite Gear stuff sack weighs 5 ounces. The difference in weight is what we needed, but it I wonder if the Sniveler still has some dampness in it.

    I hope the Orca did not pick up any weight. That would shatter my Insultex world.

  4. #44
    Senior Member fourdog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacEntyre View Post
    Well, I made it home... thick snow brought me to a halt just north of Columbus yesterday. Today, I drove through a blizzard from SE Ohio all the way to Beckley, WVA. The trip was over 2600 miles round trip, which took seven and a half days! I only drove half of that distance; TZ drove the other half. There is no better companion than TZBrown, whether you are hiking, camping, traveling, or brainstorming gear! He's what my skipper used to call "a good dory mate." Four Dog had good things to say about Tom's way of helping get things done around camp.

    We had a fantastic group of people. I wish I could have spent more time with all of them.

    You have to be very careful with a leftover head cold when winter camping in MN. I was lucky, but the congestion never left me. I took full advantage of the heated tent, and made certain I did not sweat much. Without an IX sock, I did not want to test my IX rig. OTOH, the SnugPod performed extremely well, as did the mukluks, anorak and three layers of wool shirts. I was cold only once, when I removed my mittens to get into my bunk. Cold nylon can freeze fingers fast!

    There are lots and lots of animals running around in the woods in below zero temps! We were way out in the woods, 50 miles from the main road and the last 15 miles of that on dirt roads. Each day, we saw new tracks in the snow from mice, shrew, rabbits, fox, wolf, deer and lynx. Lone Tracker's picture of a song bird's snow angel was astounding to me! I was looking for birds of prey and saw none. On the drive to MN, I saw a couple of dozen hawks and one eagle!

    Thank you everyone for a fantastic weekend!

    - MacEntyre
    Macnuk d'Nord;

    Glad to hear you made it home ! Thanks for coming had a grand time with all.
    I was honerd to share the trail with you hope to again in the future.
    Theres always a place by the fire for you and Tom.

    fourdog

    www.fourdog.com

  5. #45
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by canoeski View Post
    OK, here's the results:

    JRB High Sierra Sniveler TQ with Granite Gear stuff sack-
    wet= 2# 6.3 oz
    dry= 2# 3.1 oz for a water weight of 3.2 oz.

    JRB Mt Washington 4 UQ with Granite Gear stuff sack-
    wet= 2# 2.2 oz
    dry= 2# 0.6 oz for a water weight of 1.6 oz

    JRB down hood-
    wet= 2.8 oz
    dry= 2.5 oz for water weight of 0.3 oz (but it felt very damp)

    (weights for the MolyMac IX Baby Orca pending)

    I expected the TQ to have more moisture than the UQ because of the mylar protection underneath, and more importantly, warm moist air rises.

    Now, both quilts were used for 3 nights, and a thin Mylar space blanket was used above the MW4 UQ (but below the Baby Orca and WB Balckbird hammock). The second night at -10°F was the wettest for the TQ with frost everywhere, but I had a chance to partially dry it out in the sun for about 4 hours. They are designed very well with a black interior to absorb sunlight. It felt dry and warm for the 3rd night at -14°. I felt a little cool by morning, but not enough to get or do anything about it (I was able to sleep until 8:30 or 9)
    Thanks for that, Canoeski. I am slightly surprised that the MW4 got any moisture despite the Mylar blanket. I wonder if any moisture managed to come in from the outside?

    Still, the TQ gained twice as much water as the UQ, though I would expect it to get some extra for the reasons you stated.

    Did you dry the MW4 out in the sun for 4 hours, as with the TQ? If no, that could make the weight dif even more interesting.
    For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory that is to be revealed to us....that the creation itself also will be set free from its slavery to corruption into the freedom of the glory of the children of God. For we know that the whole creation groans and suffers the pains of childbirth together until now.
    Romans 8:18,21-22

  6. #46
    slowhike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacEntyre View Post
    TZBrown loaned me three or four winter camping books, upon which Thing1 pounced with enthusiasm. She and I have already overhauled our waterproof fire & first aid pouches and possibles bags, which we will use at Mt Rogers shortly.
    - MacEntyre
    Glad you made it home safe & sound & had such a good trip. I would have been honored as well to be in such good & experienced company.
    I love to be able to ask questions & get the up close & personal lessons.
    I'll be interested to see & hear about some of the things you learned, including the things you mentioned in the above quote.

    BTW... what is a "possibles bag"?
    It makes me think of a bag I have used at times were I kept a few things handy while I was hiking so I could easily make clothing adjustments. Particularly gloves & head wear, but also maybe a body layer too (outer shell if nothing else).
    don`t leave the CREATOR out of the creation!

  7. #47
    Senior Member canoeski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wisenber View Post
    Thanks for those results. I figured the Mylar would keep the bottom from getting wet from perspiration. At those temps, the air is probably pretty dry.

    I was surprised to see the weight of the Sniveller. The dry weight would either mean that JRB is pretty far off on their weights or that Granite Gear stuff sack weighs 5 ounces. The difference in weight is what we needed, but it I wonder if the Sniveler still has some dampness in it.

    I hope the Orca did not pick up any weight. That would shatter my Insultex world.
    Here are the weights for the Granite gear stuff sacks: 3.6 oz for the HSS, and 3.1 oz for the MW4. Both quilts are overstuffed with 2 oz of down, and they are BONE DRY.

    The Baby Orca was 9.3 wet and 9.0 dry for 0.3 oz of absorbed water. (not bad considering it was the layer closest to my body and above the mylar)

    My WB blackbird hammock (with snakeskins, SMC rings, cordage, mini-gearloft, and peakbag) was 1# 15.4 oz wet, and 1#14.3oz dry for 1.1 oz water.

    The strap suspension kit with two 15 foot straps, Dutch clips, MSH alum pegs, stuff sack, two mini-biners, and JRB mini-lantern was 7.9 oz unchanged.

    The big "winner" (or loser) was the tarp: a 10x12 CCS sylnylon with 10 guylines, snakeskins, 4 mini-biners, rope end ties/ mini fig-9's was 2# 5.1oz wet and 1# 13.7oz dry for 7.4 oz of water(all frost)

    BillyBob: I did not dry the MW4 UQ as I did the TQ since it appeared frost-free, felt dry, and seemed to retain all of it's loft. I figure the moisture must have come from the humid atmosphere in the enclosed tarp (one end closed) caused by breathing, because there was some frost on the underside of the tarp. The ambient air is very dry at those temps despite light snow 2 days. Some frost invariably falls onto the sides of the UQ and get funneled in no mater how much care you take.
    HTH.
    ~bill.
    Not all who wander are lost.

  8. #48
    TZBrown's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacEntyre View Post
    Well, I made it home... We had a fantastic group of people. I wish I could have spent more time with all of them.

    Thank you everyone for a fantastic weekend!

    - MacEntyre
    Glad you finally got there Mac. Seems funny Snow bound in Ohio, after such a long trip north.

    Hope we can do it again. I enjoyed the gear discussions, we went on for literally HOURS

    TZ
    Life's A Journey
    It's not to arrive safely at the grave in a well preserved body,
    But rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting,
    Woo Hoo!....What a Ride!

    My PHOTOS

    My VIDEOS

  9. #49
    TZBrown's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by canoeski View Post
    OK, here's the results:

    JRB High Sierra Sniveler TQ with Granite Gear stuff sack-
    wet= 2# 6.3 oz
    dry= 2# 3.1 oz for a water weight of 3.2 oz.

    JRB Mt Washington 4 UQ with Granite Gear stuff sack-
    wet= 2# 2.2 oz
    dry= 2# 0.6 oz for a water weight of 1.6 oz

    JRB down hood-
    wet= 2.8 oz
    dry= 2.5 oz for water weight of 0.3 oz (but it felt very damp)

    (weights for the MolyMac IX Baby Orca pending)

    I expected the TQ to have more moisture than the UQ because of the mylar protection underneath, and more importantly, warm moist air rises.

    Now, both quilts were used for 3 nights, and a thin Mylar space blanket was used above the MW4 UQ (but below the Baby Orca and WB Balckbird hammock). The second night at -10°F was the wettest for the TQ with frost everywhere, but I had a chance to partially dry it out in the sun for about 4 hours. They are designed very well with a black interior to absorb sunlight. It felt dry and warm for the 3rd night at -14°. I felt a little cool by morning, but not enough to get or do anything about it (I was able to sleep until 8:30 or 9)
    Canoeski Great info on the water retention.

    For a weekend, most people won't notice, but for longer, this really supports the use of a VBL in the sleep system.

    Had mine with me, but felt it was not needed for only 2 nights.

    I did not use my VBL sox Sunday morning, and had water in my boots when I removed the liners at home. I would have dried the liners if we stayed one more day.

    TZ
    Life's A Journey
    It's not to arrive safely at the grave in a well preserved body,
    But rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting,
    Woo Hoo!....What a Ride!

    My PHOTOS

    My VIDEOS

  10. #50
    all secure in sector 7 Shug's Avatar
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    Whoooooo Buddy!!!! I knew all of you would get hooked on that crackin' snow fun.
    Never a dull or down moment below 0º is there. Waking up is thrilling and that feeling of pulling those hands out of the UQ is something. All the face frost. Sweet.
    The fires were nice. I need to do that more. all the thoughts on drying out the down are so true. I experienced that and it really separates winter camping from the rest of the year.
    I loved seeing all the fires and the tarp/plastic/fire deal fourdog showed. AWESOME!!!
    You truly hosted them well fourdog. Beep .... truly sorry you had to miss it .... that is painful, I know.
    I thought MucEntyre and lonetracker competed for best dressed!!!!!
    Great report Canoeski .... loved the detail.
    When you go this spring you will be so surprised. But on of the most challenging trips I ever took was a May 1st trip on the Superior Hiking Trail in rainy, windy, snowy weather with temps at 30º.
    Here is an old, pre-video report if interested: Rain, Snow, High Wind, Blow Downs, Mud, Ice and Water For 3 Nights on the Superior
    Shug
    Whooooo Buddy)))) All Good in the Backwood Hood.

    Shug's YouTube Videos

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