TRIP REPORT:Minnesota Frozen Butt Hang - January 7-9, 2011

[MacEntyre]

...it is knowing what the weather conditions will be.

In MN, they have to prepare for both extreme cold and near freezing! We have the same problem in NC. For instance, this week it is balmy at Mt Rogers, hovering around freezing. However, when we arrive on Friday the high is forecast to be 18*F and the low Friday night is forecast to be 4*F. On Sunday, it will be back to near freezing.

In my discussions with FourDog, while riding with him to his place, I learned a good bit about his approach to being in the woods in cold weather. FourDog's stream of consciousness method of communication (he's a great story teller) requires that you listen in order to learn. Here is a synopsis:

• He will make fire always, for keeping warm, melting snow and drying gear. He expects to have to do all three.
• If there is snow on the ground, he carries minimal water.
• He makes fire with wood, and doesn't depend on other fuels.
• If it's going to be wicked cold, he wants the most breathable clothing: wool inner layers and windproof cotton outer layer.
• If temps are going to approach freezing, he switches to waterproof footwear and outer layer (I don't know if he uses a poncho or a jacket).
• He mentioned something about the minimal kit being fire making stuff, a knife and a large pot. The rest of what you need can be acquired in the woods!
• FourDog is not a weekender! The foundations of his approach are survival for an indefinite stay in the woods.

FourDog, correct me if I got this wrong!

BTW, Firewalker, Lone Tracker and TZBrown demonstrated great familiarity with this approach. Firewalker spent the weekend quietly working... gathering firewood, and helping set up and take down the Hot Tent and the parachute over the fire. Lone Tracker was able to identify tracks in the snow and nearly every twig that anyone picked up off the ground; TZ noticed Lone Tracker unconsciously collecting tinder now and then, putting it in his shirt pocket. TZBrown has a lot of knowledge in this area, and teaches cold weather camping to the Boy Scouts. I am sure there were others who take this approach as well... Stairguy had all traditional gear, but I did not spend much time discussing it with him.

[mbiraman]

Quote- TZ noticed Lone Tracker unconsciously collecting tinder now and then, putting it in his shirt pocket.- Quote

Birch bark is one of my favorite tinders . The birches are dying and its possible they may die out altogether here. I'm constantly being interrupted on my hikes by stands of birch that are shedding bark and called me to collect it. Its one of the happiest moments on my hikes. I always carry a bag with me just for that. Always feel i've hit the jack pot and puts a smile on my face.

[Shug]

MacEntyre ..... good and fine fellers you mentioned there. Had the honor of backpacking with all of them.
One of my favorite HF moments was laying by the fire late ... on our backs ....with lonetracker and fourdog just trading stories. We bonded that night like old friends I felt.
Shug

[Stovemandan]

four dog and macentyer in front of the super shelter that fourdog set up to demo for us.
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What was the reason for cutting the three live trees in the foreground?

I thought that was a no no in the scheme of Leave No Trace.

Was there a community latrine pit or just individual cat holes in the frozen ground? How was the disposal of wastes handled in this type of environment?

[MacEntyre]

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What was the reason for cutting the three live trees in the foreground?

Them are three long sticks that Firewalker sawed from blowdowns and stuck into the snow. FourDog wanted a parallel fire four or five feet long for best effect.

Anoraks are very unflattering with a water bottle and other stuff crammed into the front pockets.

[fourdog]

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What was the reason for cutting the three live trees in the foreground?

I thought that was a no no in the scheme of Leave No Trace.

Was there a community latrine pit or just individual cat holes in the frozen ground? How was the disposal of wastes handled in this type of environment?

There not live trees they are snow stakes cut from dead laying wood.

The human manure was disperesed in the envoriment to help things grow in the future.

This was not a established camp site, this was done on MN state forest land in area of 96,270 acres where the trees are harvested in a 20-30 years cycle. In that forest you have the right to camp as we did.

No live trees where killed or mutilated in this hang.

If the average person went to that spot this spring they will not even know we where there.

We took a much larger dump on mother earth on the petrol we used to get there then we did there. At worse we left it the same, at best we left it better.

fourdog

www.fourdog.com

[Lonely Raven]

My quick trip report....looking at others photos and descriptions, it's almost like I wasn't even there! Keep in mind, this was my *second* camp out with a hammock, and my infrequent camping with friends has always been car camping. So this was a leap for me, but I went for it. I knew the great company and experienced cold weather campers would be a great learning experience. I tend to be the quiet, enjoy the nature about me kind of camper. I did all my gathering of wood, maintaining the fire, photography, and other outdoorness stuff pretty much by myself.


After work that Thursday night I went home and finished packing my clothes. I had my base sleep system stuffed into ULA Circuit...clearly it wasn't big enough to hold all that down plus clothes, plus food. So I picked up a "small" pulk at Dicks sporting goods and rigged it with some rope and a spare backpack belt from a military pack. So in the pulk I loaded the pack, and a rubbermade tote with a softshell cooler full of food and fuel, then a trash bag with clothes, and spare clothes, and a "possibles bag" with first aid, extra fire starting stuff, and some spools of Amsteel in case I felt like making stuff around the camp fire during the down time. So I got a couple hours of sleep, and hit the road around 9:30pm to meet the guys up at Tobies at 9:30 or so for breakfast. It was an uneventful drive, though the flurries and big trucks made for a few harrowing stretches of highway.



Fast Forward to camping:

Setup was quick and easy. Fourdogs gave me some traditional snowshoes to try out over my boots. I think I took to walking with them easy enough, but the ties kept coming loose, and after stomping down my chosen hang area, I kicked them off for the rest of the weekend. I used These Neos overshoe over my military style 5.11 Gear Waterproof boots.





I wore some All weather glove/liners for pretty much the whole weekend, only taking them off to write my name in the snow and such. I setup my hammock, gathered wood, almost everything with them on. They are in rough shape now, but did a great job protecting me from the elements. I do wish they had more traction pads on the fingers though.



Two of the things I found neat about this campout, was the sun, and the starts. This first photo was the sun at just about 12 Noon! and the blurry star photos (really difficult to take long exposure photos at -10 below!)

That's pretty low for the sun at nearly noon! LOL










The first night I was shot after sleeping only 3 hours, driving 9, then hitting the trail, setting up, and helping to gather wood. After the awesome group meal, I crashed for a couple hours, and woke upat 9:30pm when everyone was just setting in for the night. I stayed up till about 2:30am reading a book and tending fire, then went back to bed myself. The first night was -10F, and I was pretty comfy...though my feet got cold and I had to fidget with my underquilt a bit.

Sleep system includes:

Blackbird Hammock
Winter Black Mamba Long/Wide
Winter Incubator 900FP +2 Oz overstuff
Backwoods Daydreamer Winter Tarp in Rescue Me Red

I slept in my clothes (after kicking off my boots)

Which consisted of

Mountain Hardware Windstopper Fleece (which doesn't stop the wind worth a ****) which was a great base layer that never came off.
And *two* Eddie Bauer down light "sweaters" I got during their sale. FourDogs is right, these suck for busy work, but are great for sitting around the fire, or sleeping in. One came back with a hole burnt in the lower back though...must have been a flyaway ash
For pants I wore another recommendation from beep, PCU Level 7 Primaloft pants I got from a MilSurp for only $50. Make sure they have suspenders, as they kept sagging on me all weekend!
Lastly I wore my Mad Bomber hat which also never left me...though I took it off during hikes and chopping wood as I was really overheating with it on. Awesome, warm hat!

I was terrible for base layer...I hat a polypro T-shirt, but I wore Duluth Trading jeans for the drive up, and with the Primaloft pants, I was dry and comfy all weekend, so I never bothered to change out of my jeans! I had three different levels of polypro base layer stuff in my bag, but never used them! Besides changing underwear and socks (I'm nutty about changing socks), the rest of my gear stayed the same all weekend!

I was hoping to have a hammock sock for the weekend to help keep the wind from stealing my warmth, and to help trap more heat in my environment...but I just didn't have time to make one. FourDogs let me borrow a canvas cover of some sort to throw over my hammock, but I woke up in the middle of the night having trouble breathing and feeling terribly claustrophobic. Thats never happened to me before, so I dropped the canvas and just let my tarp do all the wind blocking work. I made sure to put the tarp broadside to the wind, and I shoveled the fine powdery snow onto my tarp, let it slide down and build up a windbreak at the base of the tarp. This worked out well. My sled and all my gear stayed under the tarp with me.




I had huge amounts of frost when I woke up each morning. As mentioned before, you need to manage the frost. I was just shocked at how much front there was on the Blackbirds bugnet! And I was so dehydrated in the morning...I made sure to drink at least a liter or two of water during the day, then at least a full liter before going to bed each night. And still, I felt as dry as the desert in the morning! Each morning I hung my down gear on my guy lines in direct line with the sun to dry out. This worked well, I had no issues with my gear getting plugged up or going flat. And I was comfy down to the -14 degrees on the second night. (except for my feet)


For being the second youngest guy out there (bunch of old farts!), and probably the least experienced, I think I handled the weekend well. The company was great! The food was awesome. And I learned a lot! Fourdogs and Firekeeper are both a fount of information. Most of it is common sense (Which as we all known isn't too common these days), mixed in with a bunch of experience.

I could probably type for hours, but I don't want to bore you all. Great times were had, I loved chatting gear, and survival, and hunting, and cooking, and even photography. I was pretty laid back all weekend, just watching and listening to everything and everyone. I actually saw the wolves padding down the roads, and the eagles scouring the ground for food, and the white tails bounding away from us clumsy humans. I saw the stars twinkle in a way I've never seen them before, and saw the sun, barely warming peek up for a few hours then drop back down for a long, cold night. I heard and felt how the cold effects the woods at -14 below, and watched how everyone managed the cold in their own ways.

It was a great weekend, and one that has changed me, made me stronger and more confident.

Like was said over the weekend, if you can $h1& in the woods at -10 below, you can do pretty much anything.

[Lonely Raven]

Anoraks are very unflattering with a water bottle and other stuff crammed into the front pockets.

That was another part I forgot to mention...

Many of us looked pregnant with all the stuff we had stuffed in our jackets.

I had:

Bottle of water (always - or at least till the top leaked!)
Butt wipes
lip balm
2 Camera Batteries
Cell Phone + spare battery
Gum
Picked up birch bark and lighter


The Nikon performed flawlessly over the weekend, but there were times were the battery, which was fully charged and kept warm in my jacket would only work for 15 minutes then need to be put back into the jacket. I alternated between two batteries to keep the camera alive...but really, the frost on the lens was the hardest part to manage...that, and at -10F below, the grease in the lens started gumming up, and the lens had trouble turning!

The rest of my photos can be found here:

http://lonelyraven.zenfolio.com/p475354030

I didn't take many, as I said, it was difficult to shoot in this weather.

[Shug]

Good report LonelyRaven .... I was hoping that your time in the cracklin' Minnesota woods would be joy for you!!!!!!

As I was out practicing my act today ....I kept looking at my down hanging (major distraction) and after reading all these reports and all the Pod Posts of late I spied my 20º Western Mountaineering Bag and commenced to start hooking it on my hammock. I put on my FrankenQuilt DIY UQ and slipped in my NEW Hammock Gear Winter Insert/Summer TQ and crawled in. Sweating in moments but I was in my heated studio.
I hope to test this Thursday as it is supposed to be -10º.
Just goofing around with this .... the down does not seem compressed too much. I expected some!!!
I also have my frost bib hanging off of my ridgeline and it just slips around my neck with a big hole in it. Still under R&D..........
OK then.
Thanks for inspiring some fun for me ya'll!!!!!!!
Shug

[fourdog]

My quick trip report....looking at others photos and descriptions, it's almost like I wasn't even there! Keep in mind, this was my *second* camp out with a hammock, and my infrequent camping with friends has always been car camping.


It was a great weekend, and one that has changed me, made me stronger and more confident.

Like was said over the weekend, if you can $h1& in the woods at -10 below, you can do pretty much anything.

You done good, you showed up and did it. Thanks for coming and helping me learn.

fourdog

www.fourdog.com