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Thread: Amsteel Deal

  1. #31
    Senior Member GrizzlyAdams's Avatar
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    too fat IMHO

    Like HC4U my estimate is that the 3/16" stuff you refer to is too wide.

    The attachment shows a prussik on a cinch buckle using 3.8mm Spyderline. 3/16" is approximately 5.3mm

    Grizz
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  2. #32
    Senior Member TiredFeet's Avatar
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    I checked the Sansom catalog.

    They list the Validator SKB as a blend of Vectran and Dyneema SK-75 core with a braided covering of polyester. The Vectran is used to reduce the creep.

    They list the average strength as 4800 lbs and the minimum strength as 4100 lbs.

    They list the weight as 1.3 lbs/100'. I usually compare weights to the 2.8 mm Spyderline which is listed as 0.4 lbs/100' by APS. So the Validator SKB 3/16" is some pretty heavy rope in comparison - over 3 times as heavy. If the weight doesn't bother you, then the strength is really good.

    If that guy ever lists some Sansom 2.5 mm or 3 mm Validator-12, I would be hard pressed not to get it. The Validator-12 is awesome. The 2.5 mm is rated at 2000 lbs and weighs only 0.5 lbs/100'

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrizzlyAdams View Post
    Like HC4U my estimate is that the 3/16" stuff you refer to is too wide.

    The attachment shows a prussik on a cinch buckle using 3.8mm Spyderline. 3/16" is approximately 5.3mm

    Grizz

    Well, I am failry certain I am going to get some of the rope that HC4U had mentioned before from

    http://www.apsltd.com/Tree/d3000/e827.asp

    I saw they had 7/64, but figured I would go for the slightly beefier 1/8 rope with the 1800 lb breaking str for the prussik. Seems like that size would fit, & support me. Anyone care to chime in with a reason for me NOT to go that route?

    thanks!

  4. #34
    Senior Member FanaticFringer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by traviso71 View Post
    Well, I am failry certain I am going to get some of the rope that HC4U had mentioned before from

    http://www.apsltd.com/Tree/d3000/e827.asp

    I saw they had 7/64, but figured I would go for the slightly beefier 1/8 rope with the 1800 lb breaking str for the prussik. Seems like that size would fit, & support me. Anyone care to chime in with a reason for me NOT to go that route?

    thanks!
    I recently bought some of that 1/8 rope. Nice rope. Works perfect in a prussik knot on my cinch buckles. Get it cheaper here. http://www.reddenmarine.com/site/new...?id=AMRAMSTL18
    The bowline knot tied at the buckle holds well.
    "Every day above ground is a good day"

  5. #35
    Senior Member greggg3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by headchange4u View Post
    I may be the guinea pig on this one. Since I wanna try out a garda hitch system I was looking for line with a little bit higher breaking strength than the 2.8mm spyder line that a lot of people use.

    I initially was looking at the AS-78 Samson from APS, 2900 lbs breaking strength for 3mm line. I got a piece of this line with my Warbonnet hammock and I like it, but the cost of $1.13 per foot eliminated that line.

    My next choice is Vectrus 12 Yale, rated at 2,000 lbs for the 3mm cord. It's only .47 per foot. The Vectrus is also available with a polyester jacket that would help with the slipping of the line when using the garda hitch.
    Be sure to let us know how this works stuff with a garda hitch HC4U. It sounds great from a price, strength, weight perspective. I've tried the amsteel from APS and it doesn't hold as well as spyderline in the garda hitch.

    I'm considering a suspension system where I first put up a line with nothing but two rings in the line, tensioned using the Garda hitch at each tree (rings spaced for the hammock, so between the rings would be my ridgeline). Next I would put up my tarp using prussik's on this main line. (I know it stays taught better if tied directly to the tree, but I think I get better protection if the tarp is attached to the suspension line because it stays closer to the hammock when I get it. Using a suspension rope with minimum stretch and tensioners on the tarp help minimize the tarp sag when I get in). Finally I would clip the hammock to the rings using treklight biners. This would let me put up and take down the hammock under protection of the tarp, but would still keep the tarp snug to the hammock, so I can use a smaller tarp like the stock HH with confidence. And I can pack the wet rope/tarp separately from the dry hammock.

    So I'm looking for a strong, light weight rope with minimal stretch, that holds a garda hitch well. I was going to use spyderline but this stuff you've found sounds really good if it holds well in the garda hitch. I'm thinking I'll use the amsteel I already have in the middle between the rings for the ridgeline portion.

  6. #36
    Senior Member TiredFeet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greggg3 View Post
    Be sure to let us know how this works stuff with a garda hitch HC4U. It sounds great from a price, strength, weight perspective. I've tried the amsteel from APS and it doesn't hold as well as spyderline in the garda hitch.

    I'm considering a suspension system where I first put up a line with nothing but two rings in the line, tensioned using the Garda hitch at each tree (rings spaced for the hammock, so between the rings would be my ridgeline). Next I would put up my tarp using prussik's on this main line. (I know it stays taught better if tied directly to the tree, but I think I get better protection if the tarp is attached to the suspension line because it stays closer to the hammock when I get it. Using a suspension rope with minimum stretch and tensioners on the tarp help minimize the tarp sag when I get in). Finally I would clip the hammock to the rings using treklight biners. This would let me put up and take down the hammock under protection of the tarp, but would still keep the tarp snug to the hammock, so I can use a smaller tarp like the stock HH with confidence. And I can pack the wet rope/tarp separately from the dry hammock.

    So I'm looking for a strong, light weight rope with minimal stretch, that holds a garda hitch well. I was going to use spyderline but this stuff you've found sounds really good if it holds well in the garda hitch. I'm thinking I'll use the amsteel I already have in the middle between the rings for the ridgeline portion.
    For minimum stretch and creep, a vectrus rope would be better. Dyneema doesn't stretch much, but it does stretch. Vectrus (some call it vectran) has way lower stretch and almost no creep. For that check out the Samson Validator-12. APS sells the Samson, but call it Vectrus-12. Yale also sells a vectran rope by Yale and you can get it at West Marine.. The Samson has a coating they call samthane. AngrySparrow tried it with a Garda Hitch and found it doesn't hold as well as a rope with a polyester covering. The Yale rope has a polyester covering and that should work well with a Garda Hitch.

  7. #37
    Senior Member headchange4u's Avatar
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    My decision to try the garda hitch system has really gotten me looking hard at rope; trying to find the best balance between price,weight, and strength. I also want to keep the size around 3mm or about the same size as the Amsteel 12 7/64 I like so much.

    TiredFeet mentioned the Validator-12 Vectran line and I looked it up. I found the 3mm Validator-12, rated at a 2700 lbs breaking strength and .6 lb/100ft, for sale here for $.54 per foot. That's kinda expensive, but it has a pretty impressive resume of specs. It is a single braid with the Samthane coating that has not shown to hold the garda hitch well, but I'm sure a slip knot or half hitch would keep things from slipping. I used a slip knot to stop slippage on the ring buckles/webbing suspension combo and it worked fine.

    Another interesting canidate that I came across was the Amsteel Blue. It's described as:
    AmSteel-Blue is a 12-Strand braided rope utilizing Parallay design with our proprietary blue Samthane coating with Dyneema® SK-75 fiber. This rope yields the maximum in strength-to-weight ratio and is stronger than wire rope constructions - yet it floats. Superior flex, fatigue and wear resistance.
    .
    The 3mm Amsteel Blue is rated at 2500 lbs breaking strength and .5lb/100ft, slightly lighter than the Validator-12, but probably not enough to matter in the small amount of rope used for suspension lines. I found the 7/64 Amsteel Blue for sale here for $.14 per foot, a winner in the price dept.

    Yale Rope does make a Vetran core line with a polyester cover, Yale Crystalyne. APS no longer carries the 3mm size and I couldn't find it for sale anywhere else. It is a competitor in the weight dept. at .52 lbs/100ft but it's 1,600 lbs breaking strength is lacking as compared to the single braids.

    Even the popular 3.8mm Syderline (.82 lb/100 ft, 1900 lbs breaking strength) can't compete with the specs of Amsteel Blue and Validator-12 rope.

    I do plan of getting some of the Amsteel Blue 7/64 and try it out. It seems to be the best choice out of everything that I looked at. I will have to look into ways of dealing with the slipping garda hitch.
    “Light thinks it travels faster than anything but it is wrong. No matter how fast light travels, it finds the darkness has always got there first, and is waiting for it." -Terry Pratchett



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  8. #38
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    If it helps I have been using the 7/6" Armsteel sprectra line. I'm pretty happy and have not had any problems with it.

    Now if only I can find cheap spectra webbing.
    Is that too much to ask? Girls with frikkin' lasers on their heads?
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  9. #39
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    Ok, maybe the price isn't so bad. Yates has it for around $.40 a foot. Around $12 for my hammock setup. May have to bring this up the DIY to-buy list.
    Is that too much to ask? Girls with frikkin' lasers on their heads?
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  10. #40
    Senior Member headchange4u's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hammock engineer View Post
    Ok, maybe the price isn't so bad. Yates has it for around $.40 a foot. Around $12 for my hammock setup. May have to bring this up the DIY to-buy list.
    Gotta link?
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