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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by rjcress View Post
    Here is the prototype that I made this weekend of a 2 layer IX TQ that a HF member asked me to make for him.

    Finished the TQ prototype Saturday. Slept in it Sat night.
    Very impressed with warmth , but not happy with footbox design.
    Altered footbox significantly Sunday, will test it one night this week... likely Monday or Weds.

    The original footbox was just a tapered cone with a drawstring in the bottom.
    I hated it.
    It was smallest at the bottom, which is where my size 13 feet were.
    I added in a triangle to the bottom of the footbox seam (not the end, the bottom) to expand the foot area, but it was still too snug.

    So I added a 12"x10" panel with 2 layers of IX and made a vent in it.
    Holy cow, it is SOOOO much better.
    I'll keep thinking about the vent though. Not really happy with how the small circular vent is attached.
    Likely to make a rectangular vent that sticks out less in the one for the HF member.

    The 50" width is great. I was afraid if it were too narrow that any movement would cause air gaps or the TQ to slip off of me. No issues with that at all. I will make the HF member's TQ with a bit less width to save a bit of weight. The 6" draft tubes on each side really reduce the risk of making it more narrow.

    Shell is 1.1 rs from BWDD, IX from BWDD, inner shell is a non-rs nylon that is really soft and great against the skin. Drawcord and mini toggles from BWDD (love the new 2 hole mini toggles).
    I made a stuff sack that is about a foot long and 7" wide. I thought this TQ would just barely fit in it. However, I can stuff (not roll) the TQ in the sack AND cram my 96" x 60" fleece TQ in the same sack. Total size is about 1/2 the size of the mummy bag that I have been using as a TQ.
    I think I'm finally at the point were I'll have to go get a postal/food scale. It kills me to make this cool stuff and not know exactly what it weights.

    Attached a few pics of the prototype. Each picture has a number in the name.
    63 = prototype with the conical bottom and drawstring
    65 = the hollow draft tube that hangs on each side. Tuck it under you to seal out any drafts
    66 = original drawstring bottom
    73 = top with drawstring to cinch around shoulders
    77 = new footbox bottom with round vent
    62 = modeling different design concepts
    86 = I sewed 4 rows of longitudinal 1/4" pleats in the bottom layer of IX to provide an air gap between IX layers. This also reduces the inner IX layer width to help it wrap around the person using it.
    74 = the IX TQ AND my extra large fleece TQ both in the stuff sack.

    With the new footbox design I can pull my 80" long TQ up over my head. With the tapered footbox i could only get it to my shoulders.

    I'll make the final version next weekend. In the mean time, please share any thoughts or design ideas.

    Thanks!
    Jeff
    I really like your idea of pleating the IX (superb genius!).

    Q 1: why not pleat both layers (running perpendicular to one another)? It strikes me that by doing this you could a: create larger air spaces, or b: even better, create more air spaces (depending upon the up or down orientation of the pleats).

    The reason I ask is that I am presently in the design phase of a TQ / UQ of my own. I want to do everything possible to maximum R value with two layers of IX (because I'm cheap) while minimizing the learning curve (because I'm a "noob"). Already I know with complete certainty that I will be "press ganging" your idea concerning the pleats (l just love it). Likewise,I have no moral aversions to high-jacking any other tid-bits of wisdom you may care to impart (that's why we're all here together, right).

    **As a caveat, I should add that nothing I make is for resale (period). I'm just a cheap ******* who would rather make my own gear than pay (some other cheap *******) for it.

    And on the subject of R max:

    Q 2: Assuming one were to pleat both layers of IX, is it possible then to insert a reflective Mylar sheet (i.e. space blanket) in between the second (pleated) layer of IX and the outer rs nylon shell as a means of boosting the R value, or would this only exacerbate vapor retention issues?

    My rationale is that on a UQ it might serve the dual purposes of wind blocker and heat reflection. I am clueless as to how it would work on a TQ in terms of a: noise when shifting position, and b: vapor retention. I am certain that many of these ideas have already been repeatedly tossed around on this forum. But, gad zooks, I only wish I had the time to comb through it all.

    I hope that I have provided a spark for some new thinking, and I look forward to continuing this discussion.

    Cheers

    Jeff (in Montreal. QC)

  2. #22
    MacEntyre's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jspate61 View Post
    I really like your idea of pleating the IX (superb genius!)
    The idea has been around for year. I named them InsulTubes.

    From this post:

    Quote Originally Posted by MacEntyre
    InsulTubes are simply long, non-tapered, pleats that make a 3/8" tube and serve the purpose of keeping the layers of IX from touching. In other words, they provide loft.
    "We must, indeed, all hang together or, most assuredly, we shall all hang separately." - Ben Franklin
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  3. #23
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    I guess what I am after is: with each successive layer of IX, would you reorient the direction of the pleats 90 degrees?

    The other thing I am interested in is the idea of the Mylar to reflect the retained heat back: does this actually work, or does it cause problems with vapor build up?

  4. #24
    MacEntyre's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jspate61 View Post
    I guess what I am after is: with each successive layer of IX, would you reorient the direction of the pleats 90 degrees?
    You could do that... wouldn't hurt a thing!

    I don't think it is necessary, though. It's a lot of work for questionable benefit.

    Quote Originally Posted by jspate61 View Post
    The other thing I am interested in is the idea of the Mylar to reflect the retained heat back: does this actually work, or does it cause problems with vapor build up?
    IX is already almost a vapor barrier, so adding a SB layer won't increase the risk of condensation much. I have a Baby Orca ready to be assembled, with a reflective sheet as the inside layer. I will give it to TZ to try out, as soon as I get it done!
    "We must, indeed, all hang together or, most assuredly, we shall all hang separately." - Ben Franklin
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  5. #25
    Senior Member rjcress's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jspate61 View Post
    I guess what I am after is: with each successive layer of IX, would you reorient the direction of the pleats 90 degrees?
    I kicked that idea around.
    Also thought about doing it the way MAD777 did... he alternated his longitudinal pleats from layer to layer so that the top layer pleat touches the bottom layer between the pleats on the bottom layer.

    In the end, IX is flexible enough that I question whether the pleats are actually creating much dead air space between layers. It's not like the chambers in a down TQ or UQ where the down expands and fills and keeps open the void.

    hmmm. I may try it on the next one I make around the mid section. I don't think it would be enough benefit to do the whole TQ, head to toe, but maybe running a few short pleads across the section that is over the core and/or around the footbox would be worthwhile.
    "I keep telling myself that if I make perfect seams, nobody will believe that I made it... " -JohnSawyer

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  6. #26
    Senior Member rjcress's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacEntyre View Post
    I have a Baby Orca ready to be assembled, with a reflective sheet as the inside layer. I will give it to TZ to try out, as soon as I get it done!
    Interested to hear how this works.
    "I keep telling myself that if I make perfect seams, nobody will believe that I made it... " -JohnSawyer

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  7. #27
    MacEntyre's Avatar
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    I believe if you make the air gap between IX layers too big, it makes for cold spots. That's why I use pleats only in the Torso Heater sewn-in insert, and let the rest of the IX separate by hanging down, due to the differential cut.
    "We must, indeed, all hang together or, most assuredly, we shall all hang separately." - Ben Franklin
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  8. #28
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    I first considered making mine with the pleats running 90* to each other but mentally rejected it as I wanted the folds closer together but didn't want to sew miles of folds.

    Keeping in mind that this thread addresses TOP quilts, gravity is working against us rather than for us as in a under quilt.

    I'm happy with the look of my finished quilt, although I'm now a little worried about the simple draw string footbox. I'm actually going to try it out for the first time tonight. The predicted lows are 35*. After reading this thread, I am taking 4 pair of thick wool socks with me, just in case

    My thread is found here: http://www.hammockforums.net/forum/s...ad.php?t=29606
    Mike
    "Life is a Project!"

  9. #29
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    How did your quilt work out for you?

  10. #30
    Senior Member texron's Avatar
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    Great looking quilt, some lucky forum member is going to be happy.

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