Is GG woodland AKA Neo's tarp totally unobtainable

[oldgringo]

First, I don't believe I would use down under the conditions you describe. A synthetic, possibly Insultex would be my preferred choice.

I have an Ogee tarp that is PU coated (no, it doesn't soak up water). The tarp was made by Gargoyle, is digicam, and was a prototype (used once). It provides good coverage, and if you are interested, we can work something out. PM me to discuss details.

[Cannibal]

I'm a little confused, probably just what happens when numbers are involved.

The size of the JRB camo hex is more than sufficient for just about anything. I've spent the night passing away rainstorms with hex tarps that are smaller. I have a couple synthetic underquilts, but 98% of the time I use down. 11' (or 3.3 meters) is longer than any camping hammock I know about once set with the sag; DD hammocks included. The width will have 4' (or 1.2 meters) on each side. Gobs plenty to keep you dry.

Same is true of the Claytor tarp. Been through plenty of rainstorms under one with my down; never wet. True blowing rain presents some challenges for the diamond tarps, but nothing that can't be easily overcome with proper site selection. Wind (cold) can be tricky too, but site selection can again help with that...mostly. Which leads me to my next question, how are you getting "wind swept rains" in the jungle? Didn't think such events were even possible considering the thick vegetation.

Diamond tarps may offer more setup configurations, but the price is more limited coverage against the wind. The hex tarps are more restrictive in their configurations, but provide significantly more protection from wind. For rolling fog, none of the other tarps listed can hold a candle to the SuperFly, "bad marpat copy" and all. There is some flexibility to it given its size, but it's still a hex a heart.

Any and all the tarps you listed will cover your hammock and with some practice, they will also keep you dry and sheltered from most of the wind. Fog is an issue regardless of the tarp, but the SuperFly will help out the most on that front. Given your requirements and preference to the diamond shape, I'd probably recommend the Claytor. If camo and side coverage is your big push, the JRB camo. If it's fog that has you worried, the SuperFly. I've never used the Bushcraft tarp, so I have no opinion. Based on its dimensions it should be similar to the Claytor tarp. Just my opinions.

I take it this isn't a "pleasure" trip in the jungle, so good luck.

[ole1291]

The size of the JRB camo hex is more than sufficient for just about anything. I've spent the night passing away rainstorms with hex tarps that are smaller. I have a couple synthetic underquilts, but 98% of the time I use down. 11' (or 3.3 meters) is longer than any camping hammock I know about once set with the sag; DD hammocks included. The width will have 4' (or 1.2 meters) on each side. Gobs plenty to keep you dry.

I take note of that. Most of the time I am camping on hillsides, I worry that such a tarp, which really can only be pitched one way, may be weak on the down hill side. I thought that with a general purpose square tarp I could for example pitch it longer on the sloping side and a little shorter on the other, so I would get more protection from where the wind is coming (from the bottom of the hill upwards). Or am I missing something about the hex?
I agree 3,3m (11') is plenty enough. I likeit longer than the hammock in case the wind direction changes as it usually does during storms.

Same is true of the Claytor tarp. Been through plenty of rainstorms under one with my down; never wet. True blowing rain presents some challenges for the diamond tarps, but nothing that can't be easily overcome with proper site selection. Wind (cold) can be tricky too, but site selection can again help with that...mostly. Which leads me to my next question, how are you getting "wind swept rains" in the jungle? Didn't think such events were even possible considering the thick vegetation.

I am always walking around as part of a group, usually with locals who know the area like I never will. I have to camp wherever they decide to camp, I can't just wounder 500m away to camp by myself and I can't select the site for the group. Often we stay on hilltops which is one of the worst place wind wise. So I need to plan for the worst.
Jungle is a relative word, sometimes we enter areas that are "pure" jungle as you imagine it: thick vegetation, can't see the sky because of canopy. But mainly it is less thick than you'd imagine, we still call it jungle, but maybe there is another term. Sub-tropical and tropical are slightly different climates.

Diamond tarps may offer more setup configurations, but the price is more limited coverage against the wind. The hex tarps are more restrictive in their configurations, but provide significantly more protection from wind. For rolling fog, none of the other tarps listed can hold a candle to the SuperFly, "bad marpat copy" and all. There is some flexibility to it given its size, but it's still a hex a heart.

From what I understood reading the data at the site diamond and square are actually a bit different, for example the claytor is listed as being 4m long on the diagonal but 3m wide. That is as opposed to a square set diagonal (like bushcraft's) which would be the same length and width wise. Why I think it's potentially important? Because, a square could be rigged both, diamond and A-frame (flexibilty). The claytor, rigged as a A-frame would be uneven, and too short (2m50 long on the sides).

Any and all the tarps you listed will cover your hammock and with some practice, they will also keep you dry and sheltered from most of the wind. Fog is an issue regardless of the tarp, but the SuperFly will help out the most on that front. Given your requirements and preference to the diamond shape, I'd probably recommend the Claytor. If camo and side coverage is your big push, the JRB camo. If it's fog that has you worried, the SuperFly. I've never used the Bushcraft tarp, so I have no opinion. Based on its dimensions it should be similar to the Claytor tarp. Just my opinions.

Thanks for all your advice, you obviously know a lot about this stuff. Certainly more than me, I'll admit being a novice with anything beyond a poncho/tarp.
Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought that with a tarp like the 11'x11' Buschcraft (with its many attachment points) I could replicate a 'superfly by using as side tie outs, not the corner loops, but the next
one toward the inside, and then fold the saging part of the tarp towards the inside as 'door'. Thereby I would have an almost closed shelter, but without being restricted to that configuration as I would, I guess with the superfly?

I take it this isn't a "pleasure" trip in the jungle, so good luck.

Not a pleasure trip in the figurative sense, but not 'Afghanistan' either. thanks for the cheers and the help.

[Cannibal]

Some clarity; I like it.

With regards to pitching one side of a hex longer than the other, sure, it can be done. Just because the ridgeseam is in the center doesn't mean it has to be centered above the hammock. You'll need a continuous ridgeline under your tarp, but it's pretty easy to pitch them off-center and provide more length on one side and less on the other. Lots of folks use that trick when they run into weather with a smaller than ideal tarp. No problem.

Top of hills totally explains the wind-blown rain. Sorry about that, I just wasn't understanding wind-blown rain in a "jungle". Makes total sense now.

You're right about the diamond vs. square. Also, my experience is with tarps and hammocks. Beyond that, I'm as newb of a tarp user as they come. My only concern is that a folded configuration like you're describing is going to require additional lines strung here and there. I was more concerned about your tactical abilities and all the lines, but since it isn't that serious of an adventure I'll drop that line of thinking. It can be done easy enough, but it's going to be close quarters inside the tarp and that may make your condensation and fog issues more pronounced. I don't know for sure as I use big tarps when I want to be encapsulated, just a guess on my part really. Too bad the Sportsman Guide 12x12 doesn't come in a camo. That would really be a good bet.

I know a few of our vendors are open to custom work. If you like the pattern on the JRB hex, it may be worth your time to speak with them about a custom diamond or square tarp using their fabric. Otherwise, it sounds like the Bushcraft tarp is in the lead right now. I'd be interested in hearing more about it if you get it since there hasn't been much discussion of it here...yet.

[ohski]

The one silverlion mentioned is very interesting
at 3m35 x 3m35 (11x11) it is the right size for my current hammock (DD frontline) and should provide very good cover, it is square and has many attachment points (including some for a ridge line I think), allowing many different setups
the cost of 60 + shipping 40 tot 100 is attractive
it's made of 70D PU, so it should be durable I guess. I read somewhere that PU absorbs a lot of water when it's raining and is later heavy to carry, any ideas as to the acuracy of that statement?
the draw back is that it weights around 750g (1lb 10.5oz)

I have 2 of the BCUSA tarps... they are 10' x 10'... and yes it does get heavier when wet. I love mine... then again I'm not an U/L guy.

Good luck in your search.

Ski

[oldgringo]

"From what I understood reading the data at the site diamond and square are actually a bit different, for example the claytor is listed as being 4m long on the diagonal but 3m wide. That is as opposed to a square set diagonal (like bushcraft's) which would be the same length and width wise. Why I think it's potentially important? Because, a square could be rigged both, diamond and A-frame (flexibilty). The claytor, rigged as a A-frame would be uneven, and too short (2m50 long on the sides)."

There's a problem with this line of thinking (ask me how I know): the diagonal of a square that's big enough to provide adequate coverage when pitched A-frame style is too long to be used in a diamond pitch in many places.

[ole1291]

Some clarity; I like it.

With regards to pitching one side of a hex longer than the other, sure, it can be done. Just because the ridgeseam is in the center doesn't mean it has to be centered above the hammock. You'll need a continuous ridgeline under your tarp, but it's pretty easy to pitch them off-center and provide more length on one side and less on the other. Lots of folks use that trick when they run into weather with a smaller than ideal tarp. No problem.

Top of hills totally explains the wind-blown rain. Sorry about that, I just wasn't understanding wind-blown rain in a "jungle". Makes total sense now.

You're right about the diamond vs. square. Also, my experience is with tarps and hammocks. Beyond that, I'm as newb of a tarp user as they come. My only concern is that a folded configuration like you're describing is going to require additional lines strung here and there. I was more concerned about your tactical abilities and all the lines, but since it isn't that serious of an adventure I'll drop that line of thinking. It can be done easy enough, but it's going to be close quarters inside the tarp and that may make your condensation and fog issues more pronounced. I don't know for sure as I use big tarps when I want to be encapsulated, just a guess on my part really. Too bad the Sportsman Guide 12x12 doesn't come in a camo. That would really be a good bet.

I know a few of our vendors are open to custom work. If you like the pattern on the JRB hex, it may be worth your time to speak with them about a custom diamond or square tarp using their fabric. Otherwise, it sounds like the Bushcraft tarp is in the lead right now. I'd be interested in hearing more about it if you get it since there hasn't been much discussion of it here...yet.

Actually you are right, wrapping myself up in a tarp-tent could be stupid, and being able to break camp quickly is important. But usually, we pretty much know when we are in a 'tight' place or not. That's why I was thinking about flexibility for the tarp, something you can adapt to the situation.
I might have overstasted the importance of camo. Before, I used these Thai hammocks, which aren't made for a European man'size. At about 2m30 max, I find them really uncomfortable. Later I switched to Hennessy which was much better comfort wise but it's a little too big; when were not in the Jungle we stay in local villages, the bamboo houses are small, sometimes it's not easy or social to pitch a HH in + I found out this spring that I get better insulation from a quilt set under a somehow snug hammock (I guess because the UQ can wrap around me more). So I got myself a DD frontline which is so far great (almost as comfortable as a HH but moderate size and silhouette, and easier to debug from).
I was going to order the DD Tarp as well but I thought the color really stands out too much in a jungle environment. That's why I'm now looking for camo, but if see something that really fits my other needs and doesn't stick out too much (HH coyotee brown color is fine for ex). I'll take it.
After thinking over your arguments I'm starting to think you might be right, maybe a JRB hex is all I need:
Not too many tie outs (break camp quick), shouldn't flap too much in the wind (silent), light (we walk a lot), and (I wasn't sure but I take your word for it) it provides adequate protection for a down underquilt in severe rain protection. The last point is important though, when it rains there, it's not like here. It's really an avalanche, with strong shifting winds. Using down UQ, I don't want to take chances.

To oldgringo,
Yes, good point.

[Cannibal]

If you're that concerned about the down getting wet, make (or beg someone to make) a shield to cover the UQ. I've used a sil 'pillowcase' around my down underquilts a few times with good success. It will add a few ounces, but relieve a pound worth of worry.

[bwg]

I have the Claytor diamond tarp and found that with strong wind my hammock was getting wet (and I had the tarp pitched as close to the hammock as I could). I modified it with end guyline ties to hold the ends down when wind blown, and I also add small doors.

Given your description I would opt for a tarp with doors like the Warbonnet Superfly Camo:

http://warbonnetoutdoors.com/tarps.php

or other similar tarps with doors. Hennessy now has tarps with doors -- see the Monsoon and Typhoon:

http://hennessyhammock.com/catalog/rainflys

Blowing rain can be miserable if the tarp does not add adequate protection -- get the doors.

[ole1291]

I gave some thought about using a weather shield, but like the JRB guys say; for the added weight of a hammock sock you can just get yourself a bigger tarp and have extra room to do other stuff. I think they are right, I'd rather have the JRB cat tarp and nothing else, than their hex tarp + a sock, because I think its probably more flexible. Besides, because of the big difference between night and day time temperature over there, I'd always have to be taking the sock on/off.
I attached a picture that was taken last rainy season, so you can better picture the environment I work in. I had a HH at the time. The other hammock belongs to a local guide (yeah, their setup is ****).



At BWG, the tarps you recomend are probably the best for maximum weather protection, but I think their setup might be a little too complicated for my needs. Thanks for letting me know about how the claytor tarp performs in real bad conditions.