Will the z-liner do for 0C /30F

[patentdoc]

I have not been able to get my z-liner to 0C/32F without supplemental gear.

[Karl B. Andersen]

But I think we need to set a standard to compare cold sleep arrangements.
Like what would be a good standard night clothing . . .
1, 2, or 3 layers and of what.

I think that would be a GREAT! idea.
(The remainder of your reply was very beneficial, and I thank you.)

[DemostiX]

Here is Clark Junglehammock's estimate of the insulating value of the Z-Pad system, from their web page.

Every Clark 4-season model includes insulating pockets which restore insulation to the areas of your body which compress your sleeping bag the most. The Z-Liner enhances the insulation already provided by the Clark's insulation pockets and adds insulation to areas between your knees and feet. We recommend using the Z-Liner whenever the combination of your sleeping bag and Clark's insulating pockets is not enough-- especially when sleeping below 32 F (0 C).

Cold Weather Ratings for the Z-Liner are difficult to specify since they depend greatly upon what kind of sleeping bag or quilt you are using inside the hammock. Initial tests reveal that the Z-Liner allows you to sleep at least 20 degrees colder than you could without it under the same conditions.

Mr. St. John has had numerous opportunities to compare the Z-liner system with the one(s) he made himself. Maybe you can find in these archives such comparison and his analysis of how and why they are the same, different, and / or complementary in effectiveness.

[mark jernigan]

I Am Shopping For A Zliner Or Under Quilt For My Na Clark Any Suggestions.thanks

[NickJ]

I've had mine down to -19c and was warm in a base layer and north face blue kazoo. I'm a cold sleeper but had no problems

[grounder]

Just FYI, I am chatting with Clark through email a bit and they just told me that the TX-[12]50 is going to have a different Z-Liner - one piece that attaches to the full length of the underside of the hammock. In other words, not stuffing the pockets.

This tells me that even they recognize that the "pocket stuffing" solution isn't quite working. I still like the idea of a Clark very much but pocket stuffing always seems a bit of a "hack" solution to me.

I'm still waiting on details about weight, packed-volume and price of this new "full" Z-Liner.

[Bradley]

This tells me that even they recognize that the "pocket stuffing" solution isn't quite working..

conjecture
Not Even Close to correct . . .

What it says is: They see the need for a Tropical hammock
that can be enjoyed more by some if they add the spreader bars, and
it can be enjoyed by even more people if they add an insulation choice to a tropical hammock . . .

Your [isn't quite working] is how you see it . . . only,

And not even close to how they see it.

The [pocket stuffing] as you put it works AWESOME for me.
Even down to -13C . . . so far . . . and I was toooo warm.

The only time that you could legitimately use your Statment is:

Shortly after they had deleted their pocket line up.
Even then, you would need to change [isn't] with [didn't]

Not going to happen.

[grounder]

Yeah, that's why I said "This tells me..." and "... isn't quite working"

wow

(and aren't you the guy that has the custom stuffers that are bigger than what the Z-Liner ships with? Almost like the Z-Liner as shipped wasn't quite working for you.)

wow... again. big red bold letters, "not even close"... yikes. All I said was that they are doing something new and (probably) improving the product as a result (i.e. why would they make it worse?) and you kinda lose it because I suggested that maybe the old method isn't "quite" working.

Dude... you might want to dial down the fanatic level a bit.

[Bradley]

Dude . . . ? ? ?





When/if you ever calm down . . . or sober up . . .

re-read the posts.

What it says is: They see the need for a Tropical hammock
that can be enjoyed more by some if they add the spreader bars, and
it can be enjoyed by even more people if they add an insulation choice to a tropical hammock . . .

Your [isn't quite working] is how you see it . . . only,

And not even close to how they see it.

I have quoted it for you . . .

. . . in case you have trouble finding your way around the forum here . . .

. . . after only 11 posts.

PS. Oh yea,
You have just entered my IGNORE LIST
so I won't be able to see your reply.
I just thought you should know so you don't waste your time,
with an inappropriate answer

[grounder]

I've decided not to get a hammock... not because of this guy, but I gotta admit that it's a bit of a plus knowing that I won't have to be hanging around on the same forum as him (I probably would have gotten a Clark ).

For those of you that like this place (and by and large it is awesome), you might want to consider reigning this guy in. I've read a number of his posts and he's an (adjective-not-supplied) that makes off-the-cuff remarks that he really doesn't intend, I'm sure, but once he's done it, it's done. The person he's responded to is now pissed off and insulted... and if that's a noob, then it's not a good thing.

I fail to understand why people treat "gear" like it's the holy trinity... but people with attitudes like this do exist, and it's not doing justice to the dozens of awesome people here.

Just my $0.02. See ya.