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  1. #21
    Senior Member DemostiX's Avatar
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    Getting bivy benefits:

    Wool weight:

    You're just not searching in the right places. In woven textiles, weight or face weight is always known by someone. It isn't the only parameter, but it is a valued one.

    You are chasing a chimera because as the wool become lighter -- think the finest suitings, or what with interest in water-shedding, scarves -- it becomes more fragile, lacking in tensile strength and toughness, not to mention being subject to snagging.

    As a practical matter, the easiest and least expensive shield and cover of the UQ for backyard hammock use may be an inexpensive hammock like the Grand Trunks polyesters, selling last week for $100/8, and this week for $2 more. Adjust once with a knotted cord the effective length to the hammock bearing an UQ, attach a pair of mini-biners, and call it a day, letting dew and fog collect on that second hammock instead of on the UQ and main hammock, and letting you put those away immediately for next use after you unclip the cover in the AM.

    This rider is all for wool, especially contemporary treated stuff for use as base layer. The 4lb Irish fisherman's sweater in raw wool? Not so much. Alpaca blankets in cold mist and rain? Only with llama's to carry them and coca tea to shed hunger and cold at high altitude.

  2. #22
    Señor Member wisenber's Avatar
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    If you're bent on a wool solution, just give up the down TQ/UQ and use some of this wool batting.
    It is dead air that is needed to provide insulation, and the batting provides just that.


    It's 3" thick and resists compression. Just quilt it into serape however long you want and wear it in the hammock. Since it resists compression, it should retain its insulating ability when you lay on it. You can lanolize it to make it water resistant. My guess is that it would keep someone warm pretty close to 0. If you are needing less, go with the 1/2" option. You could double it if need be and still be insulated into the 20's.

    I've actually thought about doing that before and recently. It could be worn while hiking with no worries about wetting it out with perspiration. It's machine washable as well.
    It may not be the lightest or least bulky option, but it could take the place of TQ, UQ, coat and possibly rainwear.
    Horace Kephart mentioned something along those lines in his Camping and Woodcraft book back in 1906.
    Last edited by wisenber; 12-05-2011 at 19:39.

  3. #23
    SilvrSurfr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DemostiX View Post
    You are chasing a chimera because as the wool become lighter -- think the finest suitings, or what with interest in water-shedding, scarves -- it becomes more fragile, lacking in tensile strength and toughness, not to mention being subject to snagging.
    That does seem to be the case: the lighter the wool, the more fragile it is. My WWII Army blanket, given to me by an uncle who fought overseas, is about 4 lbs. and durable as hell. It's been through 70 + years of use. I'll still bring it with me when car camping, but back to the drawing board for overcover/undercover.

    I wonder how Tyvek would work ......

  4. #24
    Señor Member wisenber's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SilvrSurfr View Post

    I wonder how Tyvek would work ......
    If you're going down that road, just get one of these for the top and another for the bottom.




  5. #25
    Senior Member Rug's Avatar
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    Funny conversation with my wife.

    After seeing this image I sent the following email to my wife. Sit back and enjoy the madness.




    Me: Imagine how warm of a poncho I could make with this. Just need something soft on the front and back, with a head hole in the middle.

    Her: Yikes. I feel sneezy and itchy just looking at all that wool

    Me: A thick Denim cover on one side & fleece on the other, would be so very cozy. Oooh, I also need deerskin leather, I could use that instead of the
    denim. it would last forever!!!

    Her: You are too funny

    Me: But i am serious! These are skills I need to learn!

    Her: Need to learn why?

    Me: So I don't need anybody else.

    Her: Well I am not sure a poncho is going to replace companionship for the rest of your life.

    Me: Companionship? That's is why i have you. I am talking about being dependent on somebody else.

    Her: Again not sure the poncho is going to replace everything else you might need in life.

    Me: It's a start, a symbol! Something to rally behind! A banner to wave from the parapets! Behold ye fearful of the unknown and slave to modern fashion, you too can be set free and warm all winter long! Follow me to the fabric store and let the revolution begin!

    Her: Oh dear. I want whatever you are on!

    Me: Admit it you love me.

    Her: More than you can imagine
    I ride a recumbent.
    I like to HAM it up on the CW.
    I use Linux.
    I play go.
    Of course I sleep in a hammock!

    Rug.

    Hang On!

  6. #26
    Senior Member G.L.P.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SilvrSurfr View Post
    I thought Silnylon was non-breathable. Wouldn't there be a condensation issue? And at $8.75 a yard for Sylnylon 1st, it's no bargain.

    I can't find any information on the weight of wool per square yard. It's one thing to say wool is heavy, but I want to know how heavy so I can compare. If they're close in weight and insulative properties, I'll always choose a natural fiber over a synthetic one.

    I can get ripstop nylon in various weights, 1.1, 1.7 or 1.9 oz per square yard. But what is the weight of the various grades of wool? If you've ever had a Shetland Wool cable-knit sweater, you know that stuff weighs a ton. Merino wool seems twice, if not four times lighter. But what about all the other lightweight wools, like virgin lambswool, cashmere, alpaca, mohair, and angora?
    Merino wool is pretty light but it's still heavy compared to Ripstop
    Sil is waterproof but if used right it can work as an Undercover ...
    as for the price my man you are looking in the wrong place LOL
    look at DIY gear supply he has 2nd's for around $5 a yard
    Ripstop would be a better choice to be honest no worry about condensation
    and you can get it for around $3 a yard at DIY GS OR ... you can make one out of a Driducks poncho like i did for around $10 ... and you can use it for rain gear or another layer
    the big problem i think your going to run into is price per yard on wool... a good merino wool shirt is around $50-80 ... if you don't mind the weight of the wool blanket just carry that .... but don't forget your adding a good bit of weight to your setup with the wool blanket...
    have you tried doing a search for lighter wool online?
    i like the Cape idea .... that would be cool a cape made out of merino wool ... that worked as a undercover
    It puts the Underquilt on it's hammock ... It does this whenever it gets cold

  7. #27
    Senior Member G.L.P.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SilvrSurfr View Post
    That does seem to be the case: the lighter the wool, the more fragile it is. My WWII Army blanket, given to me by an uncle who fought overseas, is about 4 lbs. and durable as hell. It's been through 70 + years of use. I'll still bring it with me when car camping, but back to the drawing board for overcover/undercover.

    I wonder how Tyvek would work ......
    yeah driducks poncho would work great ....
    tyvek i'm not sure .... i would get a piece and play around with it.... see what you come up with and if you have condensation problems
    It puts the Underquilt on it's hammock ... It does this whenever it gets cold

  8. #28
    Señor Member wisenber's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rug View Post
    After seeing this image I sent the following email to my wife. Sit back and enjoy the madness.




    Me: Imagine how warm of a poncho I could make with this. Just need something soft on the front and back, with a head hole in the middle.

    Her: Yikes. I feel sneezy and itchy just looking at all that wool

    Me: A thick Denim cover on one side & fleece on the other, would be so very cozy. Oooh, I also need deerskin leather, I could use that instead of the
    denim. it would last forever!!!
    ....
    That's sort of the vision I had, although I'd go with an outer layer not made from cotton...perhaps a Filson style wool in about a 5 ounce weight on the outside and a habatoi silk inside. With the right outer shell, it would not be itchy. With it being made of wool, you could wear it near the campfire without the fear of it melting lighting up as much as synthetics.

    I see the wool batting serape as being something that Grizzly Adams would have used if he had been introduced to using hammocks as opposed to making flapjacks for Mad Jack.

  9. #29
    Black Wolf's Avatar
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    Well this thread is right on time...I haven't poured through it as I'm a bit tired right now ... I was at Hancock Fabrics yesterday and looking at.. umm..fabrics .. when I came across 100% sheep's wool quilt batting .. they said with a 4'' quilting the fibers would stay in place.. it's about 3/8'' thick .. a seems very light ... no specs on it... it was $18.00 sq/yd. ... it goes on sale at 40% off this week ... so I'll be getting 2 yds. .. I'm putting it in between fleece and some 1.9 rip-stop (1.1 Sil if I have enough).. and making it into a TQ ... that I can also use as a UQ .. or poncho .. I'm not fond of a TQ with a foot box .. I use a 550 fill rectangle TQ now .. the total cost will be around $40.00 bucks .. and hoping for about a finished weight around >24oz. ... just something different hopefully warm, with the ability to breathe well ....
    "The wise man questions others wisdom because he questions his own, the foolish man because it is different from his own." Leo Stein

  10. #30
    Señor Member wisenber's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Black Wolf View Post
    Well this thread is right on time...I haven't poured through it as I'm a bit tired right now ... I was at Hancock Fabrics yesterday and looking at.. umm..fabrics .. when I came across 100% sheep's wool quilt batting .. they said with a 4'' quilting the fibers would stay in place.. it's about 3/8'' thick .. a seems very light ... no specs on it... it was $18.00 sq/yd. ... it goes on sale at 40% off this week ... so I'll be getting 2 yds. .. I'm putting it in between fleece and some 1.9 rip-stop (1.1 Sil if I have enough).. and making it into a TQ ... that I can also use as a UQ .. or poncho .. I'm not fond of a TQ with a foot box .. I use a 550 fill rectangle TQ now .. the total cost will be around $40.00 bucks .. and hoping for about a finished weight around >24oz. ... just something different hopefully warm, with the ability to breathe well ....
    Why not go silk on the inside instead of fleece? The batting is already providing the loft (and a good deal of bulk). The silk would hold it nicely, be comfortable and reduce bulk.
    You can lanolize silk, but I don't think fleece will handle it well without gunking up.

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