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  1. #21
    OldnSlow's Avatar
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    Coffee, and Canoebie, I believe you and the author of Deep Survival have nailed it. I took my wife to a range once, to shoot a .22 handgun. The instructor calmly told my wife that she would wax me, as she had three things going for her: better eye-hand coordination, better ability to listen, and no testosterone. Oh, by the way, she did wax me.

    John

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by canoebie View Post
    It is so true that we can become complacent!! I have more problems with those who are experienced in terms of getting them to follow safe practices than those that are new. In addition, men are much more difficult to convince of risk than women. Women listen better, and respect the river, fire, etc. more than men. In general, they are also more cooperative.

    Too often, I get folks that think they are the last of the "great white mountain men" and they drink untreated water, hike alone without telling others they are leaving, go barefoot around camp, swim barefoot, on and on the list goes. I show a newbie a piece of glass I pick up somewhere, or a submerged rock that is not visible and they are convinced.

    Your observation is very accurate based on my experience and a caution to all of us to be aware and ever vigilant.

    David
    That reminds me of my favorite quote from that book. I think about it everytime I hear someone calling themselves experienced or someone asking for help from the experienced people.

    "The term experienced is often used to describe those who have been getting away with doing the wrong thing longer than others." Or something to that effect.
    Is that too much to ask? Girls with frikkin' lasers on their heads?
    The hanger formly known as "hammock engineer".

  3. #23
    Senior Member ringtail-THFKAfood's Avatar
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    Danger?

    Safety is an attitude. I have to trade out my firstaid supplies once a year because I seldom use even a bandaid while hiking. However, hanging around the house working on the honey-dos is dangerous. I have scraped knuckles and knees now from yard work.

    I do not use power tools or anything sharp while hiking. I am much safer hiking than working in the yard. At my age I seldom get testosterone poisoning
    It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.
    - Mark Twain

  4. #24
    Ramblinrev's Avatar
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    I was on the leadership team for a church youth camp into the high peaks of the Daks. These were for the most part first time backpackers and were teens. We had boys and girls in the same group. One of the "rules" we stressed over and over again was "don't step on something if you can step over it." We monitored these kids for that rule consistently, always reminding them that blow down, tree roots and rocks can trip a person up in very short time. About three days into the trip, low and behold we came across a couple who were obviously "experienced". (I love the above definition) In any event, he had stepped _on_ a small blow down tree trunk he could have stepped over. Down he had gone and broken his arm in multiple places. All this had happened within the past few hours. We had to help them evacuate because he could not manage to carry his gear to the trail head and medical assistance. After that, we were able to ease up on the monitoring we had to do.

    Of course, we used the experience as an object lesson in a variety of ways. But it did make an impression.
    I may be slow... But I sure am gimpy.

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  5. #25
    canoebie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ramblinrev View Post
    I was on the leadership team for a church youth camp into the high peaks of the Daks. These were for the most part first time backpackers and were teens. We had boys and girls in the same group. One of the "rules" we stressed over and over again was "don't step on something if you can step over it." We monitored these kids for that rule consistently, always reminding them that blow down, tree roots and rocks can trip a person up in very short time. About three days into the trip, low and behold we came across a couple who were obviously "experienced". (I love the above definition) In any event, he had stepped _on_ a small blow down tree trunk he could have stepped over. Down he had gone and broken his arm in multiple places. All this had happened within the past few hours. We had to help them evacuate because he could not manage to carry his gear to the trail head and medical assistance. After that, we were able to ease up on the monitoring we had to do.

    Of course, we used the experience as an object lesson in a variety of ways. But it did make an impression.
    I was at rocky mountain national park and a ranger there was telling me how at least one or two people are killed by lightning every year. He said they were so enamored with the storm they would stand on the edge of a steep cliff watching the storm move in and ZAP!!! He looked at me with a bit of a twinkle in his eye and said, "Nature teaches stupid people."

    I used to take delinquent youth on 10 day canoe trips, and I would show them topos where there was nothing for miles, and I would show them fresh signs of bear activity. Then I would tell them the "community guidelines" and finally end it all by saying that I really didn't have to take care of much in the way of consequences for stupid behavior; the river, the woods would do it for me. They got the picture.

    David
    Revolution is about the need to re-evolve political, economic and social justice and power back into the hands of the people, preferably through legislation and policies that make human sense. That's what revolution is about. Revolution is not about shootouts.

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  6. #26
    Member Big E's Avatar
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    I agree with most of your posts, being in the great outdoors carries with it risks that we take in a calculated effort to enjoy our hobby.

    For example this weekend we were down at RRG for an overnighter. Our plan was to start at Koomer Ridge and loop around to Grays Arch on Rough Trail, then back to Koomer via Pinch em Tight and Buck Trail. We checked the weather and it looked like if bad weather was coming it might (40% chance) hit overnight. Unfortunately, just as we got to the top of Misery Hill above Signature Rock, the heavens let loose. We had lightning hitting within a couple hundred yards of us and the rain was coming down so hard we couldn't see 10 feet in front of us. Not a pleasant situation.

    We were fortunate to get off the ridge via Pinch em Tight and Buck Trails and quickly set up camp to get some shelter. We were well prepared, but a lightning bolt a couple hundred yards closer and we could have been injured badly.

    By the way, I have NEVER been so happy to have switched to the hex tarp as I was that night when the storms came back through!!! Dry and toasty all night long!!

  7. #27
    GrizzlyAdams's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coffee View Post
    I was trying Denver, Portland, and Seattle. I got offered a job in New Orleans I can't pass up....
    congrats--gainful employment is good, and youth is a good time of life to travel. Hope you get to do some interesting outdoors things along the way.

    Grizz

  8. #28
    Senior Member Iafte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by canoebie View Post
    I was at rocky mountain national park and a ranger there was telling me how at least one or two people are killed by lightning every year. He said they were so enamored with the storm they would stand on the edge of a steep cliff watching the storm move in and ZAP!!! He looked at me with a bit of a twinkle in his eye and said, "Nature teaches stupid people."
    Me and my boys were eating lunch on an overlook when a storm rolled in on thursday, we packed quickly, ran back onto the trail, got farther into the woods and I setup my tarp between two trees that had a mound between them so no water would run down to us. Lightning never got too close, but close enough to make me worry about their safty.
    Everywhere is walking distance if you have the time. ~Steven Wright

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