Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 18
  1. #1

    Tying a knot in Amsteel

    Knot tying gurus and cordage demi Gods I'm in need of tutelage.

    I'm looking for a loop to be tied in some Amsteel that when weighted can then be untied easily. Traditionally I'd just use a figure eight knot like when tying into my climbing harness. However when I tied it in the Amsteel, put my body weight onto the knot, the cord was then very difficult to untie. So what knot out there will accomplish what I need?

  2. #2
    dangerous's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Littlerock AFB Ar.
    Hammock
    DIY Dangerous Bird
    Tarp
    DIY Rooftop
    Insulation
    DIY Apex/Argon
    Suspension
    whoopies
    Posts
    1,136
    Images
    59
    well the obvious counter question is-why does it need to be untied? Knots degrade the strength the line by as much as 50%. A simple splice can put a very clean permanent loop in the end of that amsteel and keep 90-95% of the original strength. By the way a Bowline is very easy to untie after it's been weighted, simply "break the back" of the knot and it should release (never tried it with amsteel) go at your own risk.
    -Jon-
    Beware of the man who owns one gun, he probably shoots it well.

  3. #3
    Senior Member DemostiX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Like Lewis & Clark: Wintrin' o/t Columbia again: PDX
    Hammock
    Clark w 2QZQ mod,Tropical, NX;Nano
    Tarp
    Clark micro
    Insulation
    Major down
    Suspension
    7/64 SK75 +strap
    Posts
    2,337
    Images
    13
    If you are using unsheathed Amsteel, you are trying to tie knots in the wrong cordage. If I had to, I would find some sheathing for it, because I suspect that stopper knots will be stronger if the radiii of turns are larger. Most Amsteel sold to sailors is sold with a polyester or nylon braided outer layer.

    You already know I am just making the best of discouraged behavior.

    Finally, find some knots that are designed to be untied, exploding knots. Some of these might untie with Amsteel.

    http://www.earlham.edu/~peters/writing/explode.htm

  4. #4
    Member I Splice's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    San Jose, CA
    Hammock
    Speer
    Tarp
    8x12 Sil Nylon
    Insulation
    Peapod
    Posts
    84
    Images
    6
    For an easy to untie figure eight, I'd probably use a toggle, i.e. a tent stake or a stick. You might also be able to tie the figure eight as a slipped knot.

    Depending on what you're trying to do, I might use a different knot altogether

  5. #5
    Senior Member turnerminator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Peterborough,UK
    Hammock
    DIY Pertex
    Tarp
    DIY with doors on
    Insulation
    Down and synthetic
    Suspension
    Whoopies & hooks
    Posts
    1,339
    The Evenk knot works with Amsteel. Its a great knot to learn for round camp too, probably my favourite knot. It can tied in under 3 seconds with practice. I used it for a week when my whoopies backspliced themselves, never slipped once. A tree can be double wrapped with it for greater security

    Championed by uncle Ray Mears himself and he learnt it from the Eveni reindeer hurders of Siberia.

    It'll never jam and can be tied with mitts on.

    It very similar to a standard slip knot but has an extra twist.

    http://website.lineone.net/~mark.emery/Evenk.htm
    Last edited by turnerminator; 04-16-2012 at 03:50.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by dangerous View Post
    well the obvious counter question is-why does it need to be untied? Knots degrade the strength the line by as much as 50%. A simple splice can put a very clean permanent loop in the end of that amsteel and keep 90-95% of the original strength. By the way a Bowline is very easy to untie after it's been weighted, simply "break the back" of the knot and it should release (never tried it with amsteel) go at your own risk.
    The reason the knot needs to be untied is that I'm gonna try ditching my tree straps in exchange for Amsteel and some sticks to buffer the tree from the Amsteel. I've got a Dutchware Whoopie Hook on my adjustable end of the whoopie and was just gonna clip into a figure eight knot with a loop on the Amsteel. I want to be able to retie the knot in the Amsteel Tree straps to aid in adjustability.

    I'll try the bowline and see how it goes. Thanks Dangerous.

    Demostix - It seems making the best of discouraged behavior is something i've been hearing since I was an adoloscent, haha. Yes, the Amsteel is sheathed, thanks for the tip..

    Turnerminater - Now that is an easy knot, great find. So easy in fact I have tied it a bunch of times and keep thinking i've missed tied it. Like you say a basic slip knot with a twist.

    Can anybody see any reason why the Evenk knot Turnerminater mentioned would not work with Amsteel (his link demonstrates it with one inch webbing) for what i'm trying to do with it??

    As always the HF community continues to excel in shining light for the blind. Thanks again.

  7. #7
    UncleMJM's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    College Station, TX
    Hammock
    HHExplUL; WBBB; SmokeHouse; ROO...
    Tarp
    HM Suite or HG
    Insulation
    WB Yeti, 5n1 Jerry
    Suspension
    Whoopie Sling
    Posts
    2,533
    Images
    6
    Quote Originally Posted by DemostiX View Post
    If you are using unsheathed Amsteel, you are trying to tie knots in the wrong cordage. If I had to, I would find some sheathing for it, because I suspect that stopper knots will be stronger if the radiii of turns are larger. Most Amsteel sold to sailors is sold with a polyester or nylon braided outer layer.
    Quote Originally Posted by team FTB View Post
    Demostix - It seems making the best of discouraged behavior is something i've been hearing since I was an adoloscent, haha. Yes, the Amsteel is sheathed, thanks for the tip..
    I'm confused , the amsteel that I have purchased and use for my whoopies is a braided hollow core line. I was under the impression that the sheathed line was Spectra. Can someone clear the cob webs in my head on this?

  8. #8
    Senior Member DemostiX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Like Lewis & Clark: Wintrin' o/t Columbia again: PDX
    Hammock
    Clark w 2QZQ mod,Tropical, NX;Nano
    Tarp
    Clark micro
    Insulation
    Major down
    Suspension
    7/64 SK75 +strap
    Posts
    2,337
    Images
    13
    The evenk knot is one of the exploding knots of Peter Suber's, previously mentioned. Intuitively, I like the advice i_splice gave: use a nice fat, smooth, and easily removable toggle. Probably stronger, easier on the line, and certainly most easily undone.

    As for "excel[ling] in shining light for the blind."....well think on that again, and chuckle with me on that.

    And Dangerous is right: Think of a solution not needing a knot at all.

  9. #9

    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Rochester, NY
    Hammock
    Hennesy
    Tarp
    various
    Insulation
    pads, foam
    Posts
    4,449
    Images
    17
    Quote Originally Posted by team FTB View Post
    The reason the knot needs to be untied is that I'm gonna try ditching my tree straps in exchange for Amsteel and some sticks to buffer the tree from the Amsteel. I've got a Dutchware Whoopie Hook on my adjustable end of the whoopie and was just gonna clip into a figure eight knot with a loop on the Amsteel. I want to be able to retie the knot in the Amsteel Tree straps to aid in adjustability.

    >snip<
    VERY BAD IDEA. even with the sticks it will create the wrong impression on anybody else looking at what you are doing to the tree. Think Park Ranger.

  10. #10
    Senior Member DemostiX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Like Lewis & Clark: Wintrin' o/t Columbia again: PDX
    Hammock
    Clark w 2QZQ mod,Tropical, NX;Nano
    Tarp
    Clark micro
    Insulation
    Major down
    Suspension
    7/64 SK75 +strap
    Posts
    2,337
    Images
    13
    Quote Originally Posted by UncleMJM View Post
    I'm confused , the amsteel that I have purchased and use for my whoopies is a braided hollow core line. I was under the impression that the sheathed line was Spectra. Can someone clear the cob webs in my head on this?
    Spectra(tm) and Dyneema(tm) are molecularly similar fibers from different manufacturers. Amsteel (tm? of Samson) is a line of rope /cordage made of Dyneema.

    Now that I look it up, you have caught me in a labeling error. Amsteel and Amsteel blue refer exclusively to the naked single braided Samson ropes. When Samson sheathes its line or puts a high strength braided core in it, Samson calls the core "Dyneema SKxx, not Amsteel or Amsteel Blue."

    The point about housing the line holds, though. Weight and performance-conscious sailorss, racers, will either splice naked Amsteel (and similar) to similar ropes contained within outer braids,where those outer braids protect the core while running through blocks and rigging or through hands; or they move outer layers from other rope for that purpose, as I have suggested here.

Similar Threads

  1. Knot Tying for Hammocks
    By BackPackHiker in forum General Hammock Talk
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 05-10-2012, 09:46
  2. Tying the Hennessey Hammock Knot
    By attroll in forum Do-It-Yourself (DIY)
    Replies: 19
    Last Post: 11-22-2009, 09:00
  3. Tying Flyfisher's Knot
    By attroll in forum Do-It-Yourself (DIY)
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 11-12-2006, 20:48
  4. Tying Ed Speers Hammock Knot
    By attroll in forum Do-It-Yourself (DIY)
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 10-14-2006, 16:48

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •