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  1. #1
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    Combining underquilt with insulated pad to prevent cold shoulders/knees in Ridgerunner?

    I'm really enjoying using a long/wide Thermarest X-Therm Max in my double layer Ridgerunner but do occasionally get cold shoulders/knees when I side sleep and I end up rolling near the edge of the pad. Does anyone have experience with adding an underquilt to this setup to try to prevent drafts along edges of pad? If so, was it effective? The width of the underquilts from Warbonnet and Arrowhead are only 30"-32" so I'm wondering if these will really give enough coverage along sides when I'm elevated on my already 25" wide pad. It seems like the underquilt would need to wrap the Ridgerunner up to nearly the level of the bugnet zipper to really block cold from sides.

    Btw, I've also played around with adding reflectix or CCF on the edges but then I have to move the pad to the top layer (instead of in pocket between layer where it stays put) to keep the reflectix/CCF in place and the pad moves around more than I'd like (I'm an active sleeper).
    Last edited by meteorharry; 10-04-2021 at 08:53. Reason: Trying to clarify subject of post

  2. #2
    cougarmeat's Avatar
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    You might be barking up the wrong tree. Reading your description, I'd look more towards your top quilt. Here's why ... The area that needs to block heat loss from below is just under you. That's not a very wide area. I use a Lynx with the RR and as it is specially designed for the RR, it works great for that job - but I can still feel cold because of "gaps" in the TQ if I move around a bit. I've also used a regular UQ on the RR - stretching the bungee, that normally got to the end of a GE hammock, across the spreader bar at each end. That's worked too.

    In other posts, it was mentioned that if you had to choose, with a GE hammock you want the emphasize the UQ but with a bridge, the emphasis is on the TQ. I'm guessing that's because with a GE, the hammock sides, by the nature of the design, come up and hug you. That's not the case with a Bridge Hammock. With a Bridge, the sides are kept flatter because of the spreader bars. So you have to make sure your TQ is well tucked in. A good choice for a RR is a TQ from Hammock Gear with the Wide option.

    I experimented with ReFlexit and it was enough during the summer. But I still had to pay attention to the TQ (when I wasn't using the Wide one).

    You might get a little more side coverage if you shorten the distance between the apex points. WB recommends 13 ft but a friend likes 12 ft because it feels more stable (a little more hugging because the sides aren't so taut.
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  3. #3
    cougarmeat's Avatar
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    Duplicate post - please remove.
    In order to see what few have seen, you must go where few have gone. And DO what few have done.

  4. #4
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    Thanks for your interesting diagnosis, cougarmeat! To clarify, do you mean keeping the TQ tucked under me or the pad? I am using a double-layer Ridgerunner so I don't have access to the pad when it's between the layers (where I prefer it to be so it stays put). I've found keeping the TQ tucked under me to be difficult when I roll on my side. Any tips for keeping it tucked? Do the snaps at the top of the quilt help with this? I don't often remember to use them, and typically, when I first get in the hammock I feel too warm but after a couple hours I start getting cooled off and then the drafts on edges become a nuisance.
    Last edited by meteorharry; 10-04-2021 at 12:06. Reason: make it read more clearly

  5. #5
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by meteorharry View Post
    Thanks for your interesting diagnosis, cougarmeat! To clarify, do you mean keeping the TQ tucked under me or the pad? I am using a double-layer Ridgerunner so I don't have access to the pad when it's between the layers (where I prefer it to be so it stays put). I've found keeping the TQ tucked under me to be difficult when I roll on my side. Any tips for keeping it tucked? Do the snaps at the top of the quilt help with this? I don't often remember to use them, and typically, when I first get in the hammock I feel too warm but after a couple hours I start getting cooled off and then the drafts on edges become a nuisance.
    Well, you for sure have to deal with any draft problems which are a potential problem with TQs, but not with sleeping bags(unless using the sleeping bag as a TQ, of course). This was a significant problem for me during my 1st year or 2 as a hanger, possibly made worse by the fact that I was trying to make due with a sleeping bag as quilt. I personally always had more trouble trying to use my bag as TQ, which I think is because it was just awkward trying to maintain a draft free fit around the neck and shoulders, with the hood only making that trickier. I think all of that is just easier with a real TQ which I can cinch around my neck. Plus I have 1 TQ with a built in hood which is as good as any mummy bag when it comes to preventing drafts in the head/neck/shoulder areas.

    But of course, solving that problem still does not solve the potential problem of lifting up and edge as you move during your sleep. That also was originally a problem for me. I converted more than one cold hand to toasty warm simply by abandoning TQ mode and getting inside my mummy bag, pulling that glorious hood over my hats, and zipping that sucker up. NO DRAFTS! Plus, I'm convinced that when I did that with a synthetic bag, I also picked up some additional back warmth. Maybe not enough to do without a pad or under quilt, but still enough to be noticed and enjoyed. I'm sure this is one reason I always loved my Speer Pea Pod so much, why I always considered it such a bomb proof, guaranteed top and bottom warmth: guaranteed no drafts, regardless of how much I moved in my sleep! As draft free as a mummy bag, depending on how much of a vent hole I opened up, of course. It was extremely vent-able, when desired.

    But it must have been a learning curve thing, because I finally got to where TQs were just fine even for my coldest hangs. I'm sure that adding a separate JRB hood helped with that, but I must have trained my body to avoid lifting an edge during my sleep, because I have had no problems with that in many a year.

    So, YES, you must solve that issue of TQs and drafts. But it sounds like you are specifically asking about a problem with knees, feet or butt compressing the insulation in your TQs or bag, in a bridge hammock, when side sleeping on a pad. And this can certainly be a problem. Any UQ which wraps up around the top edge of the bridge hammock, AND is in solid contact with said hammock edge, will solve that problem, IMO. And that would be most UQs designed originally for gathered end hammocks. I will attach a picture of one of my JRB UQs on a WBRR, where you can see that it comes up a fair distance above the edge where your knees might be compressing TQ insulation. On occasion I have had problems with the UQ's top edge gaping away from the bridge hammocks top edge. If I was worried about that, I have attached a thin piece of shock cord to pull the quilts top edge snug up against the top edge of the bridge hammock.

    I have an UQ(AHE) that is built specifically for the WBRR. It does NOT come up above the hammock's top edge. But I have not yet found this to be a problem, so far. Because the only place the TQ insulation will be compressed by my knees is right along that edge. And the UQ is in pretty good contact at that edge, so I think it will be OK, has been so far.

    Would you like to cheat, rather than buying an UQ just to keep your knees warm when sleeping fetal? Do you have any cheap closed cell foam laying around, that you are probably not going to need for something else? Something like WM blue pad? Cut some pieces large enough to cover your knees, then slip them in your pants over your knees. Preferably on top of some long johns, but under/inside of some long pants.Now when your knee compresses your TQ, no problem. Do the same for any other body parts that are compressing TQ insulation. This will even solve some problems for back sleeping if your pad is not wide enough, like cold elbows or shoulders.
    JRB convertible MW3 on a WBRR:
    ..............................


    ............................
    Last edited by BillyBob58; 10-04-2021 at 13:52.

  6. #6
    cougarmeat's Avatar
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    Yes, snap the snap at the head end of the TQ. Most have some kind of drawcord with a toggle so you can cinch the gather around your shoulders. Note the timing on that maneuver, whether you snap and cinch first, then pull your arms out from the sides to adjust everything else, or tug/pull on things that might need attention (camp pillow under a knee, etc.) first and cinch up last - you'll just have to play with it and find what works for you.

    How well your TQ hugs your sides kind of depends on your size. Hammock Gear's Wide option only adds 5 inches to the width but it seems to make a huge difference to the tuck-in ability. They gave that option for people who were going-to-ground - so it would be easier to wrap themselves on a ground pad. You can imagine that your RR with a ground pad is sort of half way between a GE and going-to-ground. That said, You don't NEED the wide option. it just makes that aspect a bit easier.

    Although you can use a general (i.e. - designed for a GE hammock) UQ on a bridge hammock, You have a more guaranteed fit if you use a UQ specifically designed for that bridge - the WB Lynx or the AHE Ridge Creek. And remember, the RR doesn't come up on the sides as much as a GE because it's not meant to. It's a feature that it uses less material on the sides, giving you more view from the hammock. Sure, your body weight will curve the sides up - but not like a GE. As such, even if you use a large UQ, the sides might come up, the edges of the RR will keep it from hugging you.

    As an experiment at home, spend a night in your RR as usual, then spend a night with an added extra blanket that covers both sides of the bridge. That way it will have enough material to easily tuck in the sides. Note that it doesn't have to be snug. It just needs to cover any leaks from your TQ. If you are warm with that extra cover, then - given that the temp rating for your TQ is good enough (I like it rated for a temperature 10° colder than what I'm expecting) you may have to work on keeping your TQ tucked in more - or getting a wider TQ.
    In order to see what few have seen, you must go where few have gone. And DO what few have done.

  7. #7
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    Thanks much for the detailed reply, BillyBob. Both you and cougarmeat are giving me some good ideas on experimenting and hopefully improving my usage of TQ. Your suggestion on the foam inserts is a creative one and certainly very affordable! I will give it a try. Along those lines, I was actually thinking that maybe a small panel of CCF or reflectix could be attached (maybe via clothespin or some lightweight clamp) to the inner lip of the saddlebags to give a little side coverage. As I mentioned, I like keeping the pad in the pocket between the layers so I don't want to go the pad extender route, which would require moving the pad into the main body of the Ridgerunner.

  8. #8
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    Thanks, cougarmeat. I'll have to experiment with my TQ and a blanket as you suggested. My feeling is that ideally the side coverage from an underquilt would come up to the bugnet zipper. It's not clear to me if the commercially available options will do this with a long/wide pad in between the layers flattening out the bottom of the hammock.

  9. #9
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    Thanks also for including those photos, BillyBob. Maybe a GE underquilt would work better for my purposes. Alternatively, maybe someone could make a one with custom dimensions that gives a little more side coverage but is still tailored to Ridgerunner.

  10. #10
    Senior Member hutzelbein's Avatar
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    I have used both underquilts and pads together in single layer bridge hammocks, and it helps for areas where you are in direct contact with the fabric but not the pad. It doesn't help with drafts, though. Bridge hammocks are quite a bit colder than GE hammocks, which is why as a very cold sleeper I have to use a hoodless sleeping bag to stay warm enough when I sleep in a bridge.

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