synthetic or down insulation for uk climate?

[mr tickle]

Hi

My question is as per the title, synthetic or down for uk climate?

Sometimes i stay in tarp, others in my hammock. Only last week my synthetics where soaked in fog and it rains here a lot. My locations vary throughout the uk. My trips vary from 1-4 days on foot or cycle and i have to carry extra gear for the dogs, whom sometimes also get me wet. Sometimes i just hop off a bus, sometimes i get a train to the other end of the country and then bike for a few hours.

I am currently only using diy 300 gsm synthetics which are not up to the job for either heat or weight; they measure in at (combined) between 4-5 kg, 25cm x 50 cm (compressed a bit) and have a comfort rating merely above 0C. They really take the fun out of the long journeys and cold weather so anything is an improvement.

I know synthetics will keep me warm and dry and just how critical that is, but i am sick of a full bergan. Maybe these newer synthetics are the enough of a difference? It would be nice to get more opinions from folk who have carried this kind of gear and tried both.

Winter is coming, which would you choose? Bulk and security or pack size and an optimistic solution for getting wet (which i would like to hear)?

Thank for reading

[BillyBob58]

Hi

My question is as per the title, synthetic or down for uk climate?

Sometimes i stay in tarp, others in my hammock. Only last week my synthetics where soaked in fog and it rains here a lot. My locations vary throughout the uk. My trips vary from 1-4 days on foot or cycle and i have to carry extra gear for the dogs, whom sometimes also get me wet. Sometimes i just hop off a bus, sometimes i get a train to the other end of the country and then bike for a few hours.

I am currently only using diy 300 gsm synthetics which are not up to the job for either heat or weight; they measure in at (combined) between 4-5 kg, 25cm x 50 cm (compressed a bit) and have a comfort rating merely above 0C. They really take the fun out of the long journeys and cold weather so anything is an improvement.

I know synthetics will keep me warm and dry and just how critical that is, but i am sick of a full bergan. Maybe these newer synthetics are the enough of a difference? It would be nice to get more opinions from folk who have carried this kind of gear and tried both.

Winter is coming, which would you choose? Bulk and security or pack size and an optimistic solution for getting wet (which i would like to hear)?

Thank for reading

Well, don't know how your synthetics compare to things like Climashield XP and Apex, either in warmth or compressibility? What is 300 gsm, about like 10 oz per sq yd? And is that for the total top and bottom layer of a sleeping bag, or 300 gsm for each layer ( top and bottom) of the quilts? IOW, 300 top plus 300 bottom? Because a 1 layer quilt at 10 oz per sq yd of CS Apex would probably keep me warm to at least zero F(minus 18C?) Or, broken up into two ( 1 TQ and 1 UQ) quilts of 5 oz sq. yd. each, maybe a bit below freezing. So I don't know if CS would save you any weight/bulk over what you use now.

But, consider the treated down ( for example, what is being used here:
http://www.undergroundquilts.com/uq/default.html ) This may solve your concern and keep you safe from that fog.

[mr tickle]

Hmm, approximations, 300 grams = 10.6 oz and 1 meter = 1.1 yards.

It was a single layer Regatta £10 bag off ebay that i butchered and this was the rating quoted on the bag; i thought it was per layer, however it is between 5-10 mm (1/4-1/2") per layer depending where you look, in most places it is pretty thin like a padded jacket or poncho.

How thick should 300 gsm be? I am puzzled now the snugpak/dd ones are thicker than what i have, but look around the same size packed if not smaller.

Thank you for the link, the resistant down like allied etc does sound promising and i had seen some info on it before, but i am unsure if i could even get that in the uk atm. Even with MR i would be sceptical as to how it would deal with water vapor like fog where it is exposed longer.

You have a much better range of kit and materials over there.. I have one down option that may or may not be MR down and one synthetic option for winter >< Spoilt for choice

Thanks for the reply

[hutzelbein]

Down underquilt plus underquilt protector (against the fog). That's what I would do.

If you only hike 4 days at a time, you should be fine with down. Unless you manage to get it soaked. You just have to dry it out completely, when you get home.

[Flatfishy]

I'd say the same as hutzelbein.

However, if you decide to go with synthetic I have an UQ for sale(very little use) and I'm in the lake district once a month so can hand deliver it.

Mail me if your interested.

[Moel Siabod]

You already know the answer. If your bag often gets wet then synthetic will keep you warm and happy, but if you are prepared to work to keep it dry, down will keep you warm and happy.

All the best.

[BillyBob58]

Hmm, approximations, 300 grams = 10.6 oz and 1 meter = 1.1 yards.

It was a single layer Regatta £10 bag off ebay that i butchered and this was the rating quoted on the bag; i thought it was per layer, however it is between 5-10 mm (1/4-1/2") per layer depending where you look, in most places it is pretty thin like a padded jacket or poncho.

How thick should 300 gsm be? I am puzzled now the snugpak/dd ones are thicker than what i have, but look around the same size packed if not smaller.

Climashield Apex that weighs 5 oz./sq.yd(OSY) list a thickness, or loft, of 1.2"( 30.48 mm?) when new. So I guess 10 osy would be about 2.4" or 60 mm thick?
http://thru-hiker.com/materials/insulation.php

Thank you for the link, the resistant down like allied etc does sound promising and i had seen some info on it before, but i am unsure if i could even get that in the uk atm. Even with MR i would be sceptical as to how it would deal with water vapor like fog where it is exposed longer.

You have a much better range of kit and materials over there.. I have one down option that may or may not be MR down and one synthetic option for winter >< Spoilt for choice

Thanks for the reply

You are welcome! What is MR, moisture resistant? Anyway, the Allied DWR down has just been significantly improved. Paul at UGQs has had some of the first version sitting in a jar of water for 200+ days, giving it a good shake and inversion from time to time. It is still floating dry and fully lofted on top of the water. Plus, he has done testing in a washer, and it is hard to get the down to wet out much even in a washing machine on gentle cycle. IOW, it is not going to be easy to get this stuff wet.

[mr tickle]

Down underquilt plus underquilt protector (against the fog). That's what I would do.

Cheers

Climashield Apex that weighs 5 oz./sq.yd(OSY) list a thickness, or loft, of 1.2"( 30.48 mm?) when new. So I guess 10 osy would be about 2.4" or 60 mm thick?
http://thru-hiker.com/materials/insulation.php

You are welcome! What is MR, moisture resistant? Anyway, the Allied DWR down has just been significantly improved. Paul at UGQs has had some of the first version sitting in a jar of water for 200+ days, giving it a good shake and inversion from time to time. It is still floating dry and fully lofted on top of the water. Plus, he has done testing in a washer, and it is hard to get the down to wet out much even in a washing machine on gentle cycle. IOW, it is not going to be easy to get this stuff wet.

Aye i meant moisture resistant, i shall have to rip my old one open, have a nosey and see whats what with it.

I never realised that the moisture resistant stuff was that good, i shall get in touch with UK hammocks and find out if i can get that as an option!

Thanks for the info all, much appreciated

[hutzelbein]

Honestly, I wouldn't worry too much. Use a tarp with a decent coverage, and you shouldn't have too many problems with the rain. And most of the fog should really be repelled by the outside of the underquilt. Wipe the dew off in the morning, and make sure that you dry out the quilt at home, just in case. I had rain making it under my (very small Edge) tarp this summer once and survived The rain will usually only make it to the edges of the underquilt (unless, maybe, you get in a proper rainstorm). Even if those should get soaking wet, it would not be the area that is crucial to keeping you warm. Chances are, the quilt will only get moist at the edges, if at all.

If you can get the treated down and have the money, by all means, go for it. But if you can't, don't worry about it.

I haven't used a UQ protector, yet, just a sock, but I was told that the protector helps with cold spots and adds insulation as well.