the down they sell is great.. a few more fly-away pieces than ive found elsewhere but managable, and 800+ fill power is industry standard. Anytime you hear 900 fp. you have to be skeptical. my 2¢
When I started looking for materials to make my two down sleeping quilts, I did a whole lot of hunting for the best I could afford and still get a quality product. For the down I found a company called www.feathertex.com They sell in bulk. I called them to find out exactly what their down was rated at and ended up putting in an order. My quilts turned out very well, one of them goes on every camping trip. Talking with them on the phone gave me way more info than what's on their web site.
I don't think Ed Speer would mislead anyone.
unless he's being misled.. it is a known that industry can attempt to put forth laboratory "evidence" that down is 900 fill power, and several manufacturers have refused to list this fill in their gear and garments because its just a common belief among them that in a lab, what will test as 900 fp the first few times quickly becomes 800+ (when someone claims "800+" what do you guys think the "+" means? Im curious as well... it either means 801 or 899 or something in between )
one of the best instances of withdrawl from this term was in the introduction of Marmot's "900fp" line of sleeping bags. They went on with this claim for one year, and then retracted it labeling successors to be called 850+ fill.
Im not pointing fingers at Speer, never was. I didnt mention his name until just now...
i think you're pretty safe with anything above 700.. 800 is better but not by leaps and bounds.
Well, you did say "Anytime you hear 900 fp" and Ed advertises 900. He is no fool and I am quite sure he knows what he is selling.
Instead of getting into a back and forth debate about it, let's ask Ed to give his opinion here. I'll PM him about it.
“I think that when the lies are all told and forgot the truth will be there yet. It dont move about from place to place and it dont change from time to time. You cant corrupt it any more than you can salt salt.” - Cormac McCarthy
there are others that have and do advertise 900 fill. im saying for general common sense purposes, the most valued and high quality bags in the world... Western Mountaineering - Feathered Friends - Nunatak - Valandre - and even Marmot.. none advertise 900 down. So like I said, when you hear that, if you think Speer is somehow getting 927 fill down (when there is NO official "international standard") and none of the BIG companies like the oned listed claim anything higher than 850 - then OK by me! Just know, that im skeptical. Western Mountaineering is the real deal, they sell dozens of bags per week.. and they offer "800 fill power".
personally, I like Ed. We do business all the time. He is a great part of this forum and community. But it strikes me as odd that he's the only guy in the world with 900+ fill.
so what'da say, Ed? im very open to interpretation. If my points are irrational, or unreasonable Id love to hear it. Mike
Trying to add to the conversation...
I "heard" (I think from Jeff somewhere here) that the down fill power tests are conducted in strictly controlled environments (understandable...like EPA mileage testing)
Anyway, these tests are nearly humidity free. As soon as a down bag is exposed to humidity, the fill power rating on the down is immediatley reduced...the more moisture, the less fill power.
I would then guess that the higher rated fp down would be more influenced by humidity...it is made with the lightest clusters.
IOW, in real life enviromental conditions, 800 and 900 fp down may actually have the same volume/ounce after humidity takes effect.
Just another thought...
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