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  1. #1
    Senior Member Just Jeff's Avatar
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    What role does clothing play in YOUR sleep system?

    Some random thoughts on insulation layers...all getting to the fact that I'm tinkering with my Colorado winter system and might start carrying more clothing and a thinner TQ. So how do you use clothing in your sleep system?

    - Some people sleep in very few clothes under their top quilt or in their sleeping bag, and a few people don't use any sleeping bag or top quilt, preferring to sleep only in thick insulated clothes with a pad. I'm thinking about a mix of the two.
    - In three-seasons I don't carry much at all for worn insulation. If I'm in camp, I just set up while I'm still warm from hiking, eat a quick dinner, and go to bed. If it's cool (usually when I first wake up), I put on the No Sniveler as a poncho. This has worked great so far.
    - In Colorado winters, I should probably carry a true worn insulation layer. I've been using the REI Generator. It works and it's really light considering the cost (nowhere near Nunatak)...I think it was $100 at a member's sale. But it doesn't have an integrated hood.
    - For sleeping, I definitely see the advantage of a hood integrated onto the jacket. I've been using the JRB hood...it's great and very warm. Sometimes when it's cold enough to really cinch it up, the drawstring slides up near my face, and I have to make sure it stays tucked inside my jacket around my neck. (I don't want to add velcro to my jacket, which would solve that problem.) A lighter and more form-fitting solution would be a true winter jacket with the hood attached.
    . -- The problem I see with this is that the JRB hood is THICK and luxurious, and most hoods on down jackets are thick enough to keep you warm when you're awake and moving...not when you're asleep and your metabolism plummets. I could add a balaclava under the hood, and that would give me a layering option for when I'm moving around but it's not cold enough for the big hood. But it's more weight and another piece of gear to keep up with.

    So what I've been thinking about is something like a 1-1.5" down jacket with integrated hood, coupled with either an elephant's foot (14 oz for 20F) or the No Sniveler (or another TQ of similar loft).

    This might be a little more weight b/c of the extra fabric when compared to using only a thicker top quilt, but it's also more convenient in winter up here. And probably safer, too.

    I also have a Montbell ThermaWrap...so even in the cooler shoulder seasons up here I could wear that and the Stealth instead of taking the NS.

    So what do y'all think? Would you rather carry minimal worn insulation and a thicker TQ, or more worn insulation and a thinner TQ? Pros/cons of each?
    “Republics are created by the virtue, public spirit, and intelligence of the citizens. They fall when the wise are banished from the public councils because they dare to be honest, and the profligate are rewarded because they flatter the people, in order to betray them.” ~Judge Joseph Story

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  2. #2
    Whoooo Buddy)))) Shug's Avatar
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    I have been paring down my winter wear .... still bringing a good and warm TQ or SB. For me not having to be forced to crawl in my TQ and hammock because of inadequate clothing limits me. That said ... the quest for the perfect winter clothing system is ongoing.
    I like to sleep in less these days ... I sweat less. But I have to get up at some point and add a layer say round 4:30AM. This is a usual pee break for me. Or I just always wake up. I like it ... it keeps a lot of condensation out of my TQ in winter and I can/could extend my trip.
    I have always carried a big down parka 1 1/2 lbs. Been leaving it behind in favor of my MontBell down inner jacket (short sleeves). It is warm but not enough for a deep Minnesota winter so I also carry another thicker down vest. Add my JRB down sleeves and I am good. I still have my synthetic pull-over and Packa or rain jacket left. If all that does not keep me warm .... exercise or crawl in. Legs ....Thermawrap pants and rain pants over what I am wearing and usually good to bed.
    Sleep for me is two pairs SW socks and sometimes in real cold JRB sleeves, long-johns, SW top with collar and zip and 100 weight polar fleece top, wrist-warmers, balaclava, hat, hood. Face mask if way below 0º
    Key to my warmth are wrist-warmers, balaclava and BlackRock hat.
    I feel warm.
    Shug
    Whoooo Buddy)))) I Love Onions, Grits, Greens, Livermush, NC Style BBQ, Potted Meat, Anchovies, 'Naner Puddin", Peanut Butter Pie, Red Velvet Cake and Cocoa and Straaaaaawwwwberrrry Milk and Coffee Crisps....
    I Hope Heaven has a Bakery!!!!



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  3. #3
    Dutch's Avatar
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    I also use my jrb hood only it is velcroed to my down jacket. If it is cold enough to have a down jacket I'm pretty much going to sleep with it on. It makes it nice to have my arms out and read. I really don't remove clothes from hiking at all. Maybe change my socks but that is it. I have done 100 miles already without removing my socks once. I now it is gross. I use to carry sleeping clothing but they got cut in weight reduction. Now I may have a shirt and tights that I add for camp and to sleep in and early morning camp. But I concider it added insulation and will take a lesser quilt since I have boosted my layers. On my coldest night I should be wearing everything and staying warm and I will feel successful. Then I will have a rain coat and a hot water bottle if it isn't working like planned. Mostly all this is out of laziness and desire to have a light pack. I'm not trying to be sweet smelling and I usually am not.

    I think one time when I slept in my rain pants after eating a whole bunch of roasted garlic hummus I created a new eco-system based on methane gas. When I got home I found a whole bunch of sea monkeys that died as soon as they were exposed to fresh air and sunlight.
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  4. #4
    Senior Member Just Jeff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch View Post
    I'm not trying to be sweet smelling and I usually am not.
    No, but I bet you look good in your tights and hiking skirt.
    “Republics are created by the virtue, public spirit, and intelligence of the citizens. They fall when the wise are banished from the public councils because they dare to be honest, and the profligate are rewarded because they flatter the people, in order to betray them.” ~Judge Joseph Story

    - My site: http://www.tothewoods.net/
    - Designer, Jeff's Gear Hammock / Pack Cover by JRB

    IMPOSSIBLE JUST TAKES LONGER

  5. #5
    Whoooo Buddy)))) Shug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch View Post
    .
    I think one time when I slept in my rain pants after eating a whole bunch of roasted garlic hummus I created a new eco-system based on methane gas. When I got home I found a whole bunch of sea monkeys that died as soon as they were exposed to fresh air and sunlight.
    I just gagged on my Special K!!! .... Man that is funny!!!!!!
    Whoooo Buddy)))) I Love Onions, Grits, Greens, Livermush, NC Style BBQ, Potted Meat, Anchovies, 'Naner Puddin", Peanut Butter Pie, Red Velvet Cake and Cocoa and Straaaaaawwwwberrrry Milk and Coffee Crisps....
    I Hope Heaven has a Bakery!!!!



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  6. #6
    Dutch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shug View Post
    I just gagged on my Special K!!! .... Man that is funny!!!!!!
    Sea Monkey are always funny, especially down your pants.
    Peace Dutch
    GA>ME 2003


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  7. #7
    Senior Member ikemouser's Avatar
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    I sleepin 200wt icebreakers bottoms and a thick smartwool zipup top. I also have nitriles gloves and kombi goretex/prima loft mitts and a balaclavas in my gear shelf on the wbbb. For warmer times I swap ou the 200 bottoms for 150s and the smartwool for a 150 wt tee. Winter - 2 no snivs And a pad if needed, summer-yeti and big Agnes pitch pine. Keeping gloves and balaclavas close gives me allthe range I need. J have taken
    my w inter setup to 15f with no prob.

  8. #8
    Senior Member ikemouser's Avatar
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    Setup

    I sleepin 200wt icebreakers bottoms and a thick smartwool zipup top. I also have nitriles gloves and kombi goretex/prima loft mitts and a balaclavas in my gear shelf on the wbbb. For warmer times I swap ou the 200 bottoms for 150s and the smartwool for a 150 wt tee. Winter - 2 no snivs And a pad if needed, summer-yeti and big Agnes pitch pine. Keeping gloves and balaclavas close gives me allthe range I need. J have taken
    my w inter setup to 15f with no prob.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Breck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just Jeff View Post
    So what I've been thinking about is something like a 1-1.5" down jacket with integrated hood, coupled with either an elephant's foot (14 oz for 20F) or the No Sniveler (or another TQ of similar loft).

    This might be a little more weight b/c of the extra fabric when compared to using only a thicker top quilt, but it's also more convenient in winter up here. And probably safer, too.
    I've been contemplating this exact same plan. I figured that if I ever get too cold using a jacket & elephant foot combo, I could drop to the ground and use my Tewa 3/4 UQ as added top insulation; and the hammock as a ground blanket (I normally have a cut down Thermarest with me.) Right now I have a bulky down jacket, the Mountain Hardware Sub Zero. I've been thinking about something like the Marmot Zues or a Montbell equivalent (the Alpine Light it might be called). My issue with all these down jackets is they seem just a hair short and I am worried I'd spend half the night re-tucking the back of them into the bag to prevent a draft....I don't want the sea monkeys to start ice skating back there. I think I would see a good weight savings from the elephant foot idea; at 6'2" and 240lbs I'm most likely going to need to look at a large 2 person TQ to ensure coverage as a side sleeper. Much like you, my other thought was going with a lighter TQ (40* range) and laying under it. I was looking at the JRB Springer as a light weight option that I could couple with clothing as another option to the elephants foot.

  10. #10
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    the sleeping bag will obviously give you better warmth to weight ratio than any other option. jackets, gloves, hats, etc. will give you greater flexibility and provide a nicer time around camp, at the expense of a weight penalty.

    if you are doign big miles and basically walking into camp, setting up your rig, making dinner, eating and going to bed, then i'd vote for the sleeping bag. if you are camping more than hiking, then i'd vote for the extra clothes.

    you're the guy i look to for a lot of answers though b/c you're very innovative and smart concerning hammock set ups and stuff and you're probably talking about temps in CO that we never see here in PA. lowest i've hammocked is in the teens with windchill in the single digits. so take it for what it's worth

    please post back on what you come to terms with concerning this system. i'm sure i'm not the only one interested

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