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  1. #11
    Senior Member gRaFFiX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch View Post
    I think one time when I slept in my rain pants after eating a whole bunch of roasted garlic hummus I created a new eco-system based on methane gas. When I got home I found a whole bunch of sea monkeys that died as soon as they were exposed to fresh air and sunlight.
    Dutch, you made me burn my lip on my coffee. You are one funny SOB!
    I ate a whole jar of Greek Peppers with some homemade Tacos on my last overnighter of the summer. I had hung on a ridge near 6500' so the night was cold and windy, and I had my SB cinched over my face. Well at some point during the night, there was an emergency evacuation from the rear, and with the SB over my face, I "Dutch Ovened" myself summtin fierce!

    As far as my sleep system goes, I change outta my hiking cothes into lite sweat pants and a cotton t-shirt, a synthetic balaclava, and a fur lined aviator's hat with the ear flaps clipped down. If it's going to be really cold (Shug don't laugh, California gets cold in winter... for us) I put on my thermal underroos. I usually wear a clean pair of socks because my feet get really cold, and any sweat will take the heat away. I also will bring my nalgene, with boiling water, to bed if it's really cold and have luke-warm water for breakfast when I wake up.

    It's not perfect, but it works for now.
    Those who expect disappointment are never disappointed.

  2. #12
    Senior Member Triggerhpy's Avatar
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    Increase the dead air space around you fron you tarp in. Cover your head, dry socks and gloves. With that said, the rest is up to you and your style of sleeping. I go with KIS-KIF. Keep it simple, keep it fun.
    Tortoise never for a moment stopped, but went on with a slow but steady pace straight to the end of the course.
    Translated by George Fyler Townsend. Aesop's Fables (p. 18). Amazon Digital Services, Inc..

  3. #13
    Senior Member E.A.Y.'s Avatar
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    Great timing for this discussion! I'm thinking of switching things up a bit.

    In the past I've brought a change of clothes for sleeping in and used a heavier top bag. Basically, my hiking clothes, a lightweight sweater for just in case, and sleeping clothes. Means I tuck myself into my hammock and read until I'm sleepy if it gets chilly in the evening.

    This spring, I'm thinking of trying out more layers at night and a lighter top quilt. Especially since my upcoming overnighter is with a group and I'll probably spend more time sitting around chatting at night then I usually do. So the more portable layers of insulated jacket and fleece pants will come in handy and a lighter quilt than I usually would carry this time of year will mean the insulation-for-sleeping weight is about the same, with more versatility in the system.

    I do sweat a bit when I sleep so I am not sure this will work for me, but a short overnighter is probably the best place to test it out.

    I'm dithering around about underquilts/pads/combo. I'll probably make up my mind for this next weekend's trip on Friday night!

  4. #14
    Senior Member gRaFFiX's Avatar
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    Eay, where are you overnighting? You seem to have quite a bit of knowledge about the trails a little closer to Sacramento.
    Those who expect disappointment are never disappointed.

  5. #15
    Senior Member E.A.Y.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gRaFFiX View Post
    Eay, where are you overnighting? You seem to have quite a bit of knowledge about the trails a little closer to Sacramento.
    This is a ways away from Sacto: on an organized group outing east of Chico.

  6. #16
    MedicineMan's Avatar
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    Yes JJ good time on this one. In May I'm scheduled to do Conn and Mass on the AT. On the bottom will be a 3 season Yeti but I've got an Arc AT I'm thinking about using on top in conjunction with a WM Flash Jacket for sleep.
    The layers will be Smartwool tights and a Beartooth merino hoody; which are camp/sleep clothes.
    I'll also carry a pair of down socks and a Black Rock down hat.
    A 1/4 inch ccf pad doubling as a sit pad and backpack frame pad (Mariposa pack) will bridge the feet to the hips.
    That's the current plan for 1st of May weather in Connecticut...I may chicken out and take the 3 season Mamba.

  7. #17
    Senior Member G.L.P.'s Avatar
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    i also have been working on my cloths system...i'm going to use my down sweater in place of my orthface vest and down sleeves...saves me about a pound in weight...
    i was also thinking of getting a lighter down quilt and using more layers to save on bulk and weight...i did the same thing that Dutch did and i don't carry alot of extra cloths ..socks and raingear at the most and my down sweater ...
    It puts the Underquilt on it's hammock ... It does this whenever it gets cold

  8. #18
    Senior Member ringtail-THFKAfood's Avatar
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    layering

    Jeff,

    You would be surprised how little it takes to keep your torso warm if you keep your hands, head and feet warm.

    My current winter clothes from head to toe are:

    REI storm hat,
    Sportif fleece hoodie,
    300 wt. fleece jacket,
    Cheap shell anorak,
    Fleece mittens convertable to fingerless,
    Expedition weight longjohns,
    Wind pants from Wal*Mart,
    UnderArmor socks,
    Trailrunners,
    Overshoes.

    What you did not see at the hang was a bag with Gore-Tex mitten overshells,
    OR Windstopper balaclava,
    goggles,
    Extra fleece mittens.

    I have used that combination at 10 below in a 25 mile an hour wind and was comfortable. Having NO exposed skin is a good option when the weather goes south.

    A pair of possum down gloves live in the tunnel pocket of the hoodie.

    I also carry the same MontBell down sweather that I carry in the summer, but down is only good for camp or downhill skiing.

    Everything that I wore at the hang costs less than an eVent parka.

    At night I take off the shell and windpants and sleep under a Nunatak ARC Alpinist - 20 degree bag. I also had a JRB Biker quilt, but it was not a factor.

    Consider carring some plastic bags for vapor barrier on your feet and a trash bag for vapor barrier on your torso.
    It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.
    - Mark Twain

  9. #19
    Senior Member Just Jeff's Avatar
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    That sounds like a great plan, food. I've used produce bags from the grocery store as VBs for my feet before (at Winnemucca in Yosemite)...it made a difference, but I was still a bit chilled b/c my boots weren't suitable for the temps.

    I'm thinking of getting possum down gloves as liners for my OR mittens (that I can't find b/c they're stuck in a box somewhere for the move...which is why I didn't bring them on the CWH). I have some cheap fleece ones that have worked ok but I think the possum ones will be warmer for the weight.

    I got a windstopper fleece balaclava from Target that I wore at the hang...it was about $15 IIRC and it's the best one I've used yet. I have a Blackhawk one and a military issue one, and neither blocks the wind or fits as well as the Target one. I got a Youth Large and I love the way it's cut. Fits great.

    I also like the Serius neo-fleece facemask. I have the one w/o the neck gaiter...just a face cover. I usually wear it w/ just a beanie or the JRB hood when it's cold. Have to figure out if I want that or the balaclava on future trips.

    Also thinking about getting a Blackrock down beanie. Snow sticks to the fleece ones and melts, so the Blackrock might be just the ticket. Couple it with the Serius and I'd have a good daytime combo, then add the down jacket at night.

    One concern I'd have w/ the down jacket sleep system is damage. Damaging a jacket isn't a big deal if you can just crawl into your bag at night, but if I got a bad cinder or ripped a big enough hole, I could be hurting come nighttime's sub-zero temps. I guess I could always boil up a hot water bottle or just lay by the fire if I had to, and mountaineers have been using this system forever, but still...something to consider re: the lightweight approach. Mountaineers normally carry their parkas and elephant's foot on summit bids or quick trips, but still have their big bags at base camp.

    Anyway...just something I've been thinking about. I might change to this kind of setup for winter trips (relying on thicker clothes and a thinner TQ or elephants foot), and go with the NS and no extra insulation for summer trips. I'm wondering how often I'll actually take the Stealth in summer out here since we get at least a bit of snow every June at 7000'...and even the small peaks out here (Saylor Park area of Pikes NF) average 9000'.

    Keep the ideas coming! I'm really interested in how everyone balances clothing vs TQ/SB, and how this changes by season.
    “Republics are created by the virtue, public spirit, and intelligence of the citizens. They fall when the wise are banished from the public councils because they dare to be honest, and the profligate are rewarded because they flatter the people, in order to betray them.” ~Judge Joseph Story

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  10. #20
    Señor Member wisenber's Avatar
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    I'd say that a lot of the answer may depend on the length of the hike. If I'm out for a night or two, I might not mind carrying more, but I'm also less susceptible to a catastrophic failure. I don't "budget" my insulating clothes in my sleep system. Rather, my insulating layers are my "buffer" for an unforeseen drop in temps or a quilt losing insulating capacity due to moisture.

    Normally, I do as Jeff mentioned. I hike, set up camp, eat and then go to bed. As a result, I tend to take less insulating layers worn. I must confess that the Mt. Rogers hangout threw me off. I usually don't hang out in camp all day, and I stayed chilled most of the time. However, my normal cold gear DID keep me plenty warm in my hammock. If I'd been hiking instead of sitting during the day, I probably would have been much warmer.

    One bit of gear that I do wear to sleep during cold weather is my raingear. The raingear tends to keep my sleepgear and my hammock cleaner and dryer from perspiration and body oil. (I'd much rather wash my DriDucks than a quilt.) It also gives me a bit of insulation and vapor barrier effect.

    I don't have a JRB hood, but I do have a BPL synthetic hood. I've found that to do wonders in terms of keeping me warm. I still bring the light SW balaclava and that is my go to piece of headgear at about 2 ounces. I also wear the balaclava under the BPL balaclava for some of the same reasons I wear my rainsuit. It keeps my synthetic BPL hood cleaner, and I can breath through it on really cold nights without fear of collapsing my insulation. I REALLY appreciate being able to wear the hood or stow the hood without worrying about which jacket it's attached to. With a separate hood, I can choose to bring different jackets.

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