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  1. #1
    BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Speer PPod more or less by itself

    This is a follow up on a discussion on Speer tarps that was starting here:
    http://www.hammockforums.net/forum/s...ad.php?t=15399

    Quote Originally Posted by MacEntyre View Post
    ........................

    Except for the PeaPod, my Speer gear (SWT, TB, hammock) is the lightest way to go................................
    Quote Originally Posted by BillyBob58 View Post
    MacEntyre, what temp range have you found your PPod usable to BY ITSELF, if you have ever yet tried to use it that way? Or maybe by itself plus whatever clothing you might have along on a not too cold trip?
    Quote Originally Posted by MacEntyre View Post
    I've used it at 24*F by itself.

    Thing1 used it at Mt Rogers, 8*F with a little IX pad for anti-CBS. She had a lot of clothing on...
    All Thing1 needed extra on top at 8F was a lot of clothing? Quite impressive indeed, IMO. No TQ at all? And you used it to 24F with no TQ? But was that at least with a good bit of clothing? Either way, assuming every one was adequately warm, very impressive. After all, if it is going to be 20*F or colder, most folks will have some warm clothing with them, and many will use it to augment their sleep system

    OK, here is what I am getting at. Most of us agree that the Speer Ppod, while it has a few drawbacks of it's own, and will not work on every hammock and is not for every one any way, (I know at least one person who hated it) the pod is a very efficient approach to being warm in a hammock. Almost every one who has tried one has been successful on first try, being warm at least to rated temps, seems to me. I am convinced that the main reason for this success and efficiency is the near total "seal" at the hammock edges, which greatly decreases the effect of any gaps under you(IMHO) AND the big and roomy semi-mummy bag approach. Which greatly lessens draft problems, no doubt in my mind. BUT:

    There seems to be an idea that the PPod is not the lightest approach. For one thing, it is BIG, big enough to engulf an entire hammock top to bottom, end to end. And I personally agree that it is not ALWAYS the lightest approach for top insulation. For two main reasons: 1:you have to insulate all of that area in the foot end on one side of the hammock where your feet are not if laying diagonal. It only seems natural that a TQ, only big enough for your feet, would be more efficient for the weight. And 2: the other reason is the tendency of (especially wider) hammocks to raise the top layer over your body by several inches. Resulting in a bag that can not match it's 20F rating on top, despite OVER 2.5" of top loft.

    But things are not always as they seem and not always that simple. I do agree that, for most folks with say just a pair of long Johns will not be warm enough on top, in a wider hammock, at the rated temp. In fact, super cold sleeper Ed Speer only rates it to 50 on top by itself! That is not very impressive for this kind of weight, though I think that rating is WAY conservative.

    Once you start adding even very light TQs on top or below, it is easy to exceed the 20F rating, by a lot. Even just adding enough clothing can help with that. But what about just using the pod by itself and with maybe the clothing you might have for a trip with forecast lows in the upper 20s worse case? Or what worse case in the 30s or 40s? How does the PPod stack up then, with just clothes to augment, for top warmth? The 20F on the bottom rating does not vary unless you start adding stuff. But what about on top?

    Going byMacEntyre's report from above for many people, the 30s or low 40s would seem not out of line at all, along with some amount of warm clothing. In my case, 27F first night using warm clothing mainly to layer on top to fill the gap and to block heat leaking around the breathing hole. Just barely warm enough 1st night, toasty on each following night in low to mid 30s. Snow, wind, rain. (Yay JRB 10x11 tarp!)

    The newest PeaPods weigh ~38 oz. Lets say lots of folks will be OK mid to high 30s with Pea Pod alone and at least some good long Johns. Does that sound like a reasonable guess? OK, 38 oz for a TQ and full length UQ rated to mid 30s on top. Keep in mind that a more narrow hammock, like a Claytor, will tend to push the PPod closer to it's top rating of 20*F, the rating that would normally be expected from it's 2.5 plus inches of top loft( 5" plus total).

    What should be the weight of two separate LONG/TALL quilts that would be warm enough in this range with a hammock? I'm thinking a minimum of 34-35 oz., and that would be for probably ~ 1.5" single layer loft. So, is the PPod really very much heavier than something else as warm over all? Or say if you are only expecting temps to the high 30s-low 40s, is the Pea Pod, by itself, really all that heavy to take on such a trip? Although, you could save a couple more oz if you didn't need long. What do y'all think?

    Folks with experience using the Pea Pod by itself, or with just some warm clothing already carried, please chime in with your results. People want to know!
    For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory that is to be revealed to us....that the creation itself also will be set free from its slavery to corruption into the freedom of the glory of the children of God. For we know that the whole creation groans and suffers the pains of childbirth together until now.
    Romans 8:18,21-22

  2. #2
    BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Using torso length UQs and pads and TQ will, of course, be lighter than either the Pea Pod or two separate full length quilts. But some people prefer the full length option, and drafts can still be a challenge.

    EDIT: and don't forget a hood(or something) for your head when comparing weights. Worth a couple of oz or maybe more. Less of this is needed with the Pea Pod, which has a fairly functional hood. It is not a perfect hood, but you can end up with a couple or 3 inches of loft around your head and face if desired.
    Last edited by BillyBob58; 03-16-2010 at 14:24.
    For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory that is to be revealed to us....that the creation itself also will be set free from its slavery to corruption into the freedom of the glory of the children of God. For we know that the whole creation groans and suffers the pains of childbirth together until now.
    Romans 8:18,21-22

  3. #3
    Senior Member Wentworth's Avatar
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    As I've said a few times before, I've never been warmer than when using the peapod. I seal it right up and have no problems with condensation or weight gained from moisture the next morning.

    Regarding insulating the foot end of the hammock, I've considered semi-inflating one of my sea to summit drybags, filling it with my spare stuffsacks and tying it with a bit of cord in the foot end of the hammock (inside the peapod).
    This would get rid of some of the dead air space and require no extra weight, since I'm carrying it all anyway.

  4. #4
    BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wentworth View Post
    As I've said a few times before, I've never been warmer than when using the peapod. I seal it right up and have no problems with condensation or weight gained from moisture the next morning.

    Regarding insulating the foot end of the hammock, I've considered semi-inflating one of my sea to summit drybags, filling it with my spare stuffsacks and tying it with a bit of cord in the foot end of the hammock (inside the peapod).
    This would get rid of some of the dead air space and require no extra weight, since I'm carrying it all anyway.
    Something like that may be a good idea! Filling up extra/un-needed room with stuff you already have with you.

    I have also been looking at filling the end opening holes with any thing not used, like a jacket or even socks, or pack towel, anything available. That way I won't need to try and cinch the ends down as tight trying to have no hole on the far end for warm air to escape. Just in case too tight on the end might possibly effect hammock comfort. Especially on longer hammocks like the Claytor NN, where the ends of the pod are a pretty good distance from the ends of the hammock. ( But not with a Claytor Expetion, the pod actually covers the end channel on that one!)

    I can usually get the end opening mostly closed off by just fooling with the pea pod so that a channel/tunnel/baffle of down is laying down into that area, if you know what I mean. Or just tightening enough. But, yesterday I stuck part of my fleece jacket in the foot end cinch point. So then my feet were laying on the rest of the fleece jacket. Man that sure gave me some toasty feet, and quick!
    For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory that is to be revealed to us....that the creation itself also will be set free from its slavery to corruption into the freedom of the glory of the children of God. For we know that the whole creation groans and suffers the pains of childbirth together until now.
    Romans 8:18,21-22

  5. #5

    ἑταῖροι
    Hetairoi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BillyBob58 View Post
    Something like that may be a good idea! Filling up extra/un-needed room with stuff you already have with you.

    I have also been looking at filling the end opening holes with any thing not used, like a jacket or even socks, or pack towel, anything available. That way I won't need to try and cinch the ends down as tight trying to have no hole on the far end for warm air to escape. Just in case too tight on the end might possibly effect hammock comfort. Especially on longer hammocks like the Claytor NN, where the ends of the pod are a pretty good distance from the ends of the hammock. ( But not with a Claytor Expetion, the pod actually covers the end channel on that one!)

    I can usually get the end opening mostly closed off by just fooling with the pea pod so that a channel/tunnel/baffle of down is laying down into that area, if you know what I mean. Or just tightening enough. But, yesterday I stuck part of my fleece jacket in the foot end cinch point. So then my feet were laying on the rest of the fleece jacket. Man that sure gave me some toasty feet, and quick!
    I've used socks and other unused clothing with success, but I've found that a pair of JRB sleeves work GREAT for that purpose!

    Can't add much to the rest of the discussion because I always have way, way too much quilt and cloths, but I'm always warm
    Live by the sword, die by the arrow

  6. #6
    BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hetairoi View Post
    I've used socks and other unused clothing with success, but I've found that a pair of JRB sleeves work GREAT for that purpose!

    Can't add much to the rest of the discussion because I always have way, way too much quilt and cloths, but I'm always warm
    I bet that would work great! Yet another multipurpose use for JRB sleeves!
    For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory that is to be revealed to us....that the creation itself also will be set free from its slavery to corruption into the freedom of the glory of the children of God. For we know that the whole creation groans and suffers the pains of childbirth together until now.
    Romans 8:18,21-22

  7. #7
    Señor Member wisenber's Avatar
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    The main thing keeping a peapod user from getting the complete benefit of all the loft is the gap on top along with the Velcro. I've found putting a stuff sack or anything in the foot area and putting a jacket or something near my head will get me to the claimed temp levels. Of course you can use many of the hints and tips in Ed's book to exceed those levels without packing anything else.

  8. #8
    New Member Edvvard's Avatar
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    Sorry to bring up an old topic here, but I'm still not convinced that a peapod style sleeping bag over a hammock is that bad of an idea. I haven't tried it, so I could just be imagining how it would work in the wrong way. Wouldn't a peapod, if done correctly, hold more heat in and work a bit more efficiently than a top/underquilt set up?

    In regards to the loss of heat along the velcro, why not an extra baffle running length- wise? I keep wondering because I'm in the planning stage of an AT thru hike and it just seems like a peapod(DiY) in combination with some sort of lightweight sleeping bag liner would get me through the whole hike...

    I figured when it warmed up the peapod could be opened up more to become more like an underquilt of sorts.

    But again, I have no experience with any of this as I'm in the planning stage. I have seen pics of a man with a sleeping bag wrapped around his hammock in the snow that seemed to work on here I think, though.

  9. #9
    MacEntyre's Avatar
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    Gosh, BillyBob, I never saw this thread! You probably thought I didn't want to talk about it... I'm sorry!

    Quote Originally Posted by BillyBob58 View Post
    All Thing1 needed extra on top at 8F was a lot of clothing? Quite impressive indeed, IMO. No TQ at all?
    She had a Speer Top Blanket.

    Quote Originally Posted by BillyBob58 View Post
    And you used it to 24F with no TQ?
    I used a Speer Frog Sac.

    I should have clarified this for you back in March.
    "We must, indeed, all hang together or, most assuredly, we shall all hang separately." - Ben Franklin
    www.MollyMacGear.com

  10. #10
    in it for the naps oldgringo's Avatar
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    Are end caps an option? I'm thinking sil nylon, or maybe Tyvek. What about IX?
    Dave

    http://www.uark.edu/misc/xtimber/rna/pattonsbluff.html

    It has always been my private conviction that any man who pits his intelligence against a fish and loses has it coming.
    John Steinbeck

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