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Thread: Toggle failure

  1. #11
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    LR, thanks but I have some too. Guess I am switching now.

    cutter

  2. #12
    Senior Member Buffalo Skipper's Avatar
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    I use solid wood toggles

    I guess I have always been leary of hollow shafts. They can be bent, crimped or compressed form one point to inhibit failure. For that reason, I made my shafts out of solid wood, shown here. These are wooden pen blanks turned down to 1/2". These are purpleheart and paduak. I also have some made of kingwood, cocobolo and bocote. All these were chosen for their appearance, but also for their long grain and breaking strength. I always carry one spare.
    “Indian builds small fire and stays warm, white man builds big fire and stays warm collecting firewood”—unknown

    “The cure for anything is salt water - sweat, tears, or the sea”—Karen Blixen

  3. #13
    Dutch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cutter View Post
    We went for a short hike around Kennesaw Mountain Battlefield, GA, had lunch and hung the hammock for a short rest.

    The hammock is a ENO double with whoopie slings, tree straps, and carbon fiber arrow shaft pieces as toggles. I hung the hammock between two tree wider than I normally hang, but within the overall length. For some reason, I put a overhand knot in the webbing over the whoopie sling. Thank goodness.

    I gently reclined and then laid back. I was there probably 3-5 minutes when, POP and the hammock dropped a bit. I thought maybe the webbing slide. When I checked it, the arrow shaft toggle was missing. It had busted and was completely missing. I only found one half. The picture is blurry, but included. I have hung from these toggles a few nights before and did not have a problem.

    I think that I put too much force on the toggles by decreasing the angle in order to cross the span.

    Cutter
    I have had the same problem. I also get frustrated when my toggle turns when adjusting it. I never quite trust them and I have to check them every time i get in my hammock. I have since moved away from the Marlin spike hitch and that is why i make Dutch biners. It is actually a lighter set up, but what I really like is i have the security and convenience of a biner with the adjust-ability of the whoopie. Rather than a shameless plug I will send you a pair with some continuous loops for free. Just pm me your address.
    Peace Dutch
    GA>ME 2003


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  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cutter View Post
    LR,
    it may had fallen down, but it was definitely over the knot. The carbon "appears" stronger than the alum. but who knows. I will keep testing it out.

    cutter
    Carbon fiber may have relative high "strength" to weight ratio, but lacks modular resiliency when compared to many substance. Impact damage or cut fibers may not be visible. At least until catastrophic failure results. I've witnessed numerous nordic ski poles snapping. Twice have experienced two high content (+90%) carbon fiber windsurf masts snap while sailing.
    Noel V.

  5. #15
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    You guys have convinced me to go a different route.

    Dutch: pm sent. A huge thanks.

    Cutter

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch View Post
    I have since moved away from the Marlin spike hitch and that is why i make Dutch biners. It is actually a lighter set up...
    I must confess to being less than knowledgeable about Dutch biners (although I love my Dutch clips!!!); but how do you rig your suspension such that its less overall weight than the almost weightless Marlin Spike?

    I'm using carbon arrow shafts right now and although I haven't had any failures yet; you guys have certainly gotten my attention.
    David

    The road goes ever on and on Down from the door where it began. Now far ahead the Road has gone, And I must follow, if I can, Pursuing it with weary feet, Until it joins some larger way, Where many paths and errands meet. And whither then? I cannot say.
    -Frodo Baggins, The Fellowship of the Ring

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by BurningCedar View Post
    I must confess to being less than knowledgeable about Dutch biners (although I love my Dutch clips!!!); but how do you rig your suspension such that its less overall weight than the almost weightless Marlin Spike?

    I'm using carbon arrow shafts right now and although I haven't had any failures yet; you guys have certainly gotten my attention.
    Well the Dutch Biner is only a little over 9 grams each. If you use a marlin spike hitch, most people usually carry around a 6 to 8 foot piece of webbing. but you would need at least a 5 foot piece. With the Dutch Biner you only need a 3 foot hugger for most trees (I carry one 3' and one 4'). So you are trading off 1 to 3 foot of webbing to a 9 gram Dutch biner and an amsteel loop. Now if the hugger is too short I can use the whoopie to make up the difference. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IrYQMW9SHikWith the MSH you definitely need a piece of webbing that is bigger than the largest tree you will hang from. You will not be saving a lot of weight as there isn't much to cut out, but I can make it lighter and have the safety and convenience of a biner. Plus I have the water break and a I can remove my wet suspension for packing.
    Peace Dutch
    GA>ME 2003


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  8. #18
    BurningCedar's Avatar
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    Thanks Dutch for the explanation and the YouTube link. Now that I've looked at it a bit more closely, it makes much more sense to me.

    Of course that means I'm going to have to invest in yet another suspension system; but heck -- that's one reason this hammocking stuff is so fun
    David

    The road goes ever on and on Down from the door where it began. Now far ahead the Road has gone, And I must follow, if I can, Pursuing it with weary feet, Until it joins some larger way, Where many paths and errands meet. And whither then? I cannot say.
    -Frodo Baggins, The Fellowship of the Ring

  9. #19
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    I tried CF shaft with tree huggers and whoopie slings.... Hmmmm not the most comforting sound as the shafts creaked and groaned under the load, swapped out to 2 1/2" x 1/4" dia solid alum rod.... very light and super strong.... Now if I can just figure a way to keep them attached to the tree huggers I'll be all set....
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  10. #20

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    No failures here yet (And I routinely swing in my hammock) but just like CF flyrods, there are different wall thickness for the "Weight " of the rod. So you can't make a blanket statement about CF toggles w/o considering this variable. Certainly wouldn't use them for greater than 2 ft off ground. Before climbing in I make sure the Whoopie is "set" in the knot area. I made my first toggles out of Al arrowshafts w/o failures also. Al prob is the best wt vs possib failure ratio IMHO.
    "Take me away to a quiet place where beings melt into inner space. Every step brings me closer to see, my haven away beneath the trees." From Beneath the Trees by Everett Dort

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