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  1. #41
    Senior Member Law Dawg (ret)'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctari View Post
    Those who can, DO!
    Those who can't, Teach.
    And those who can't teach, coach.
    And those who can't coach, supervise.

    Too many rules, too many laws, and far too little common sense. Probably your average ranger would see our POV (they normally get into this line of work because they love the outdoors too) but the rule makers have a way of making common sense against the rules.
    Mark is the name and If there is more than one way to understand what I just said....I meant the good one.

    Earth First! We'll dirt bike ride the other planets later.

  2. #42
    Senior Member TadTheTinker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctari View Post
    Those who can, DO!
    Those who can't, Teach.
    Those who are clueless, make the rules.
    The further you get from knowing ANYTHING about the subject, the more likely you are to have the power to enforce your rules. And the harder it is to challenge your "Rules".

    Sadly, it's a fact of life. Case in point: I drive an ambulance that is REQUIRED by law to carry a 5 Lb sledge hammer & a crow bar "For use in vehicle extrication". Ive been doing EMS just shy of 30 years & have NEVER even seen their use demonstrated. For vehicle extraction we just use the "Jaws of life" (a copyrighted name BTW) or similar product. I can open a car in about 30 - 60 seconds once set up. Yet, the (Indiana) law requiring the hammer & pry bar is still in affect, & will be in the foreseeable future. The law makers haven't had to get into a damaged car for rescue in over 30 years, IF they ever did (Which I doubt), yet,,,,,,,
    <Sidebar> - The sledge and crowbar are worthless right up to the point that the Jaws spring a leak and become unusable. Then that sledge and crowbar are all you've got. Take it from a firefighter that has had the hydraulics go to pot when you need it. (But them, the engine should have the tools not the ambulance - <end sidebar> I digress.

    <Back on topic>
    As for the hammocking in parks, I would want to get a lot more information before I started showing anyone anything. (My salesman mentality coming to the surface here.) Someone needs to sit down with the authorities and find out why the rule is the way it is, where the rule comes from, and what EXACTLY they are interpreting the rules as meaning.

    Once these have been determined you can look at where they are making the decision that a hammock is not a "Camping Unit". Are they concerned about people sleeping naked in a rope hammock where you can see everything? Is there a concern about damaging the trees they are hung from? Or could it be that a previous director got into an argument with a stuck up hammocker about using hammocks and so he 'banned' them all together. (No I am not saying any of us are stuck up, just the guy in the argument.)

    If they are worried about seeing too much skin, we can show that the hammock is enclosed. If the concern is damaged trees, we can demonstrate the use of webbing and how it doesn't hurt the tree. If the ruling comes from a previous administration, a simple discussion about how hammocking is becoming more mainstream and a general talk about LNT, not damaging trees and the like will serve the purpose.

    To quote a famous military hero - "Knowing is half the battle!"
    The more you can learn about why they rule the way they do, the better prepared you will be to change the way they think and why they feel the way they do.

    Good Luck and rooting for you!
    Help a Boy Scout Troop in your area - become a mentor.

    God created Firemen so cops would have heros.

  3. #43
    Senior Member southmark's Avatar
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    Tad, I have not met with the manager as of yet but I do know from an incident a couple of years ago at another state park that they would not let someone camp with a tarp and ground cloth. The reason they gave was that the state park rule required a "commercially made" tent and this rule was in effect to keep the homeless from setting up camp in state parks. Don't know if the hammock situation is just a continuation of that thought process.

  4. #44
    HangingKayaker's Avatar
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    Just went through the same thing in Jasper National Park. They seemed unsure as to whether I could hang or not so I had to cart in my tent as well (this was a 4 day kayak trip). I was told by a back country expert that I could hang my hammock, as long as it was over a designated tent site. I was able to do this in both the campsites I stayed. I did notice in the one site that there were permanent wire lines (for tarps) attached to trees with pieces of fire hose as tree huggers. In my mind not any different from my tree hugger straps.

  5. #45
    Senior Member Cannibal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TadTheTinker View Post
    To quote a famous military hero - "Knowing is half the battle!"
    Gooooo Joe!
    Trust nobody!

  6. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by Barefeetz View Post
    After seeing several threads illustrating the ignorance of policy makers and enforcers, perhaps a hammock camping advocacy group is a good idea.

    Hammocks
    Are
    No trace
    Gear

    ...or something like that. Seems like everyone has a non-profit these days. I've done consulting work for a few myself. If people are serious about having rights equal to other campers, and LNT education, then why the heck not? Get donations from the gear makers, partner with a few (sane) enviro groups, and poof, 501(c)3
    +1. Great idea
    +1
    "truth is uncontainable, and inexpressible. It neither is nor is not.
    This unformulated principle is the foundation of the different systems of all the sages."
    Diamond Sutra

  7. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by bigbamaguy View Post
    Southmark:
    Sorry to hear about the grief you are getting from the establishment!!!!!!! If you would like, I will go with you and do a group hang on the grounds of the State Capitol building in Montgomery. It might be interesting to see how many of the state leaders we could get out on the lawn taking a tour of our gear. Let me know if you want to try this idea out.........
    I would love to do that, but you better bring some extra long trees straps, some of these trees are pretty large....
    "truth is uncontainable, and inexpressible. It neither is nor is not.
    This unformulated principle is the foundation of the different systems of all the sages."
    Diamond Sutra

  8. #48
    Stormstaff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barefeetz View Post
    After seeing several threads illustrating the ignorance of policy makers and enforcers, perhaps a hammock camping advocacy group is a good idea.

    Hammocks
    Are
    No trace
    Gear

    ...or something like that. Seems like everyone has a non-profit these days. I've done consulting work for a few myself. If people are serious about having rights equal to other campers, and LNT education, then why the heck not? Get donations from the gear makers, partner with a few (sane) enviro groups, and poof, 501(c)3

    I LIKE it!

  9. #49
    Senior Member JohnSawyer's Avatar
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    San Diego has a number of really nice county parks that I'd love to go hang at... The only issue is the rule that effectively says: Nothing gets tied to any tree. Period. I understand the ruling... One park is in the middle of a really old forest of oaks that are truly stunning. (and shady in the summer!)

    So I throw my PHS in my truck and go anyway... CA State Park rules are a bit more obscure... National forest areas with wilderness permits mean I find a spot off-trail and do what I want...

    John
    "Do or do not, there is no try." -- Yoda


  10. #50
    New Member alacamper's Avatar
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    at the begining of all this he said you could have a hammock hanging just you couldn't sleep in it and I know there is no problem with a tarp in an al. campground so it can't be anything with unsightly camping equip. it has to be some kinda liability with sleeping in it. I don't know all I can say is its crazy and I will be in a hammock if they don't like it then I will go elsewhere their not the only game in town


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