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  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by DemostiX View Post
    NE Ropes makes a Dyneema rope of stronger fiber and braid STS 12-90, but it does not come in a nominal 2mm size, the smallest being a nominal 3mm and listed as weighing .71kg per 100 meters, with a strength of 1546kg =3400lb. Thats about the same weight and strength as Samson's AS79 and AS90 of the same nominal 3mm nominal size. Basically all within rounding and model error of one another in breaking strength and weight.

    The listed weight for Dynaglide has previously been measured by two HF members at about 75g per 100 ft, or 230g per 100 meters. Interesting that NE Ropes' listing for ST12-75 should also be incorrect beyond rounding error in the digits they report in their catalog. The catalogue I consulted also shows a weight of .3kg per 100 meters.

    Is the braid of your NER ST12-75 the same as the Dynaglide, same number of crossings per inch? There's another product sold in Commonwealth nations, Stein Safety's "Skyline Throw" which is likely the same as Dynaglide. Same market, nominal diameter, colors, package lengths, and pricing.
    I did not choose the STS 12-90 because it was larger and heavier.

    I do not care to get into a discussion on the accuracy of the figures listed by NER. That discussion has already been completed elsewhere. I am only listing an alternative to dynaglide for those like myself who are not a fan of the bright colors. You are free to choose whatever cordage you feel appropriate for yourself, as I do for myself.

    FWIW, I measured a sample of both Dynaglide and Endura-12 as above and understand that the smaller sample size would lead to a potential larger degree of error compared to a larger sample. The purpose was to compare the two cords' weight, not to verify NER measurements. By my scale, both would weigh ~73g/100', close to what others have reported.

    I have not counted the number of crossings per inch and doubt I will do so. Non-empirically they look the same. Sorry if this this is not satisfactory to you. I will beg your indulgence, as I have now been up for 26 hours having started a string of night shifts last night. Again, I do not wish to rehash a discussion that was had previously as it turned rather contentious.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by BER View Post
    7/64" =~2.7mm. 2mm=~5/64". 1/8" = 3.1mm. Holding the Endura-12 and Dynaglide side by side, they seem to be esentially the same diameter to the naked eye, and both smaller than the 7/64" amsteel which I also have.
    Ahh I see, sorry I didn't know the mm conversion, and I didn't look very hard (no google foo this time)!
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  3. #13
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    Ber, STS-12-75 says its 100% dyneema and Endura-12 was 100% HMPF fiber. Is that the same thing?
    After reading some it looks like Amsteel Blue and STS-12-75 are the same thing. Both being 12 strand 100% Dyneema SK-75. Only difference is Amsteel isn't offered 2mm. great find Ber. I like the grey color as compaired to yellow zing-it.
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  4. #14
    Senior Member DemostiX's Avatar
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    Across manufacturers, sizes, especially for these hollow cords are somewhat nominal. Or ordinal. Bigger is bigger within the same product line, but not necessarily bigger than an another mfgs cord or line of the same fiber, construction, and weight even though the nominal size (eg 1/4", 2mm, 3mm, etc.) is the same. In small sizes, some manufacturers don't label small cord in fractional sizes, like 2.5mm. So, a 2mm line may be small and a 4mm line large, as though so a nominal 3mm line can fit in to the product list.

    That is not to minimize differences in coatings mfgs use to protect the cord and alter feel. But, coatings seem to have small effect on diameters and weights. If Dynaglide seems stiff, that would be what arborists would want for throwing or shooting a bag through leaves and branches with minimized tangling.
    Last edited by DemostiX; 10-28-2011 at 15:45. Reason: editing

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by DemostiX View Post
    Across manufacturers, sizes, especially for these hollow cords are somewhat nominal. Or ordinal. Bigger is bigger within the same product line, but not necessarily bigger than an another mfgs cord or line of the same fiber, construction, and weight even though the nominal size (eg 1/4", 2mm, 3mm, etc.) is the same. In small sizes, some manufacturers don't label small cord in fractional sizes, like 2.5mm. So, a 2mm line may be small and a 4mm line large, as though so a nominal 3mm line can fit in to the product list.
    After reading this post now for the fourth time, I believe I now understand what you are saying. And agree that this is probably correct. Accuracy and precision are not their strong suit. Looking at the cord I received, although it is listed at 2mm on the website, the spool is actually stamped 1.8mm. Does this make a difference for my use? Probably not. It is still smaller and lighter than 7/64" Amsteel, and still quite comparable to Dynaglide, which in the end was the end, I was looking for.

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by DemostiX View Post
    Across manufacturers, sizes, especially for these hollow cords are somewhat nominal. Or ordinal. Bigger is bigger within the same product line, but not necessarily bigger than an another mfgs cord or line of the same fiber, construction, and weight even though the nominal size (eg 1/4", 2mm, 3mm, etc.) is the same. In small sizes, some manufacturers don't label small cord in fractional sizes, like 2.5mm. So, a 2mm line may be small and a 4mm line large, as though so a nominal 3mm line can fit in to the product list.

    That is not to minimize differences in coatings mfgs use to protect the cord and alter feel. But, coatings seem to have small effect on diameters and weights. If Dynaglide seems stiff, that would be what arborists would want for throwing or shooting a bag through leaves and branches with minimized tangling.
    With all due respect, I'm struggling to see how any of this matters, all BER said was... as an alternative to Dynaglide NER also makes a similar product of a less bright color and a slightly softer hand,all other things appear to be equal. The only possible disputable difference being listed weight vs. actual weight. In the end it was BER's experience that they were the same weight.
    These were statements of his actual experience, and if you have longed for a dynaglide-like rope in a not so bright color, you now know one exists, take it or leave it.
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  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jazilla View Post
    Ber, STS-12-75 says its 100% dyneema and Endura-12 was 100% HMPF fiber. Is that the same thing?
    After reading some it looks like Amsteel Blue and STS-12-75 are the same thing. Both being 12 strand 100% Dyneema SK-75. Only difference is Amsteel isn't offered 2mm. great find Ber. I like the grey color as compaired to yellow zing-it.
    The STS-12-75, Endura-12 and Dynaglide descriptions list them as HMPE (high modulus polyethylene, sometimes called UHMWPE--ultra-high molecular weight polyethylene). Amsteel Blue also is made of HMPE. Dyneema is the trade name of HMPE fiber produced by the Dutch company DSM. Spectra is the trade name for HMPE produced by Honeywell.

    Some more information you never really needed to know about HMPE from wikipedia.

  8. #18
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    Demostix, I fully respect the fact that you are a truth-in-numbers, accuracy and precision kinda guy (I am too, but only to a point). The bottom line is that none of us here (to my knowledge) produce these products or work for the companies that do. So ultimately, I can't speak to their marketing or advertized numbers.

    If it would be of benefit to you, I'd be happy to send you 5' of my Dynaglide, 5' of this STS-12-75/Endura-12, and 5' of my Amsteel 7/64". (I could probably find some left over Lash-it and throw in some Kelty Triptease too--just for giggles). Perhaps you could do an in depth comparison/review and post your findings. I think it would be an interesting read coming from you. But doing this type of comparison is beyond my own personal interest.

    PM me if you are interested in this just-for-you offer.
    Last edited by BER; 10-28-2011 at 17:55.

  9. #19
    Senior Member DemostiX's Avatar
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    Before BER's measurement, those unfamiliar with the pair of products from NERopes would believe from the manufacturer-published specification that they differed in weight by .2kg per 100 meters = 200 grams = seven (7) oz.

    Or, put another way, NE Ropes STS12-75 was twice the weight of NE Ropes Dynaglide. Or so the spec sheets' report.

    No hanger would choose one over the other using a weight difference that large?

    RE: Nominal sizes. Follow the thread, which I respected the OP to not interupt except to point out that another poster concerned with size had missed something important about mfg - labeling of cord with size: that it is nominal (and ordinal within product line) but not necessary accurate, and therefor not strictly comparable across product lines or across manufacturer. (As an example, Yale Cordage offers their Ultrex in "2mm" size. It is made of Dyneema and listed as weighing .16Kg / 100m, by far the lightest "2mm" Dyneema cord I've found. Until BER weighed 2mm STS12-75, I thought from my compilation of specs that it weighed twice as much as 2mm Ultrex.) Whether your suspension is of 2mm, 2.5mm,3mm or 4mm Dyneema / Spectra depends on the manufacturer and product line.

    Further respecting OP's posting, I did not raise what could, by now, be an obvious question: You trust a manufacturer with its reports of breaking strength of cordage when it misreported the weights of both of the ones you are interested in, not by a little, and not in the same direction, but by large amounts not explained by rounding error at the level of reported precision?

    Curiously, Samson's Zing-it 2.2 and Lash-it 2.2, both of Dyneema, are listed as weighing .24kg per 100/meters, different from .23kg for the NE Ropes products by no more than measurement error or what might be due to differences in coating. The listed breaking strength of Zing-It 2.2 and Lash-it 2.2 is 590lb.


    Finally:

    There is nothing I would do with a length of STS12-75 but count the number of pics or crossing per length, because with the same quantity and quality of fiber, the construction of the cord affects its strength. Anyone can do that measurement in a minute without tools.

  10. #20
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    DemostiX - We understand that you have a problem with NERopes published specs for Dynaglide (and other products). That has been made abundantly clear through the posts you've made to several threads. We hear you. So much so, in fact, that we're tired of hearing it.

    Take it up with NERopes directly. But the point has been sufficiently made here that it doesn't need to be repeated.
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