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  1. #11
    Senior Member ninjahamockman's Avatar
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    I would try some M50 good stuff just like blankete.
    Bacon and Camping makes me happy.

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    I camp in bear country and I am a bear Burrito.

  2. #12
    2Questions's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacEntyre View Post
    You are correct.

    Bed sheets lack the dimensions you need, and are likely a little thin. They are also usually a cotton poly blend.

    4 oz canvas like they sell at fabric stores will do fine.

    Technical Note on Canvas for Extreme Cold

    - MacEntyre
    2questions for you Mac.....imagine that!

    First, after reading your explanation about temp and humidity differentials and the benefit of canvas to achieve equalization of the differential, do you have an opinion which of the two is more important? Is the humidity differential more of a concern than the temperature differential? If so, could I assume that anytime it would snow...versus rain I would be better off using a canvas sock than a VBL?

    Secondly, have you tried to dye the canvas? I bet the canvas would dye well....you know for those who prefer the stealthy appearance?
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  3. #13
    WV's Avatar
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    Tim, Mac or Fourdog can speak to this better than I, but I believe the benefits of canvas start well below the temperature at which it might snow. This is real cold weather technology. For temps down to zero I'd use Pertex or Momentum 90.

  4. #14
    MAD777's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2Questions View Post
    Secondly, have you tried to dye the canvas? I bet the canvas would dye well....you know for those who prefer the stealthy appearance?
    I'm sorry, sometimes my mind paints a picture for me as I'm reading a post. I saw a tie-dyed sock of bright rainbow colors. Probably not the stealth look you were after.

    Please disregard the ramblings of an old hippie.
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  5. #15
    Senior Member blaktee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by watertones View Post
    How low have you taken that down to? Any issues with condensation?
    Quote Originally Posted by SwinginIt View Post
    Yeah, inquiring minds wanna know...
    I have had it down into the teens. This stuff is magic. It is super light and cuts the wind like crazy. No condensation at all because it does breath. We have not had any colder weather than the teens yet this winter...so hopefully I can get it below 0. Really you could go as cold as your other gear will let you. It is an easy 10 degrees warmer in the sock, and no wind. The no wind part is what really makes the sock good, cuz you can trap that dead air and not lose the warmth when a gust of wind comes rockin through.

    Canvas would work the same...my only problem with canvas was the weight. I needed it to be light!

  6. #16
    2Questions's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WV View Post
    Tim, Mac or Fourdog can speak to this better than I, but I believe the benefits of canvas start well below the temperature at which it might snow. This is real cold weather technology. For temps down to zero I'd use Pertex or Momentum 90.
    So your thought is that the differential of temp and humidity has to be more extreme for canvas use...and that a fabric less breathable will suffice to that point? This past weekend I used our 1.1oz calendered ripstop as a hammock topcover and condensation definitely freezes on the inside with a temp about 30. Will M90 act any differently?
    Last edited by 2Questions; 11-19-2012 at 10:40.
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  7. #17
    WV's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2Questions View Post
    So your thought is that the differential of temp and humidity has to be more extreme for canvas use...and that a fabric less breathable will suffice to that point? This past weekend I used our 1.1oz calendered ripstop as a hammock topcover and condensation definitely freezes on the inside with a temp about 30. Will M90 act any differently?
    I guess it depends on whether weight is a factor. If you're pulling a pulk the extra weight of a canvas sock might not matter. The top half of my hammock sock-tent is Pertex Microlight, which I believe is similar to M90 in that the weave presents a lot more surface area on the outside so moisture that condenses on it and travels on the fibers by capillary action can evaporate (or freeze and then sublime) faster there. At least that's the theory, as I understand it. When we were at Mt. Rogers three years ago I had substantial frost on the outside of my sock in the area just over my head, but only a little bit on the inner surface. As you recall, that was with temps below zero. Up around 32 I've seen a lot more condensation, but that was liquid. I believe more moisture was on the outside, but it was hard to quantify.

    My question about using canvas primarily for extreme cold may not apply to socks used under tarps. I may have been thinking of canvas tents or anoraks used without additional waterproof layers. That's when you really don't want to have rain or even heavy wet snow.

    That pretty well exhausts my knowledge of this. Fourdog? Help us!

    By the way, with your 1.1 calendered ripstop, did you have the shiny side in?

  8. #18
    Senior Member stairguy's Avatar
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    Hold the cotton fabric up to your mouth, if you can easily breath thru it the weave is not tight enough. Pass it up............
    " Wiggs "

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  9. #19
    2Questions's Avatar
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    Hmmmmm.....good question. The shiny side is inside. I can see it should be on the outside. I"ll try uncalendared tonight.
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  10. #20
    MDSH's Avatar
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    Between the discussion of hydrophilic down treatment in another thread and the technical note above I'm thinking there must be a rule of thumb about relative humidity that determines the choice of fabric type for a sock.

    Mike

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