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  1. #191
    Knotty's Avatar
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    I've never had a true Nalgene 32oz widemouth leak (off brands have) so I consider the risk with it minimal. Efforts to constrain weight, cost or both don't always allow for you to have what you need plus safety margin. If a night turns colder than forecast, a hot water filled Nalgene in the hammock is an effective and easy solution. Not sure I'd try it with other products. Have seen too many people get leaks in their Platypus and other bladders.
    Knotty
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  2. #192
    Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by BillyBob58 View Post
    That is true. But, what if you can't stand to eat anymore, and you don't have anymore layers? What if the layers you have been using have been A-OK at 20*F, but now you are debilitated for any number of possible reasons and you are shivering at 30*F? Or, maybe you have messed up and some of your insulation is wet? (stuff happens)
    I hope this doesn't sound pissy cause it isn't intended that way. Tone is hard to "get" in thread postings...

    IMO a hot water bottle is a marginal aid, a bit of a psychological boost. I worry that people might think it can be considered as an important part of their sleep system.

    It is a nice trick, like adding some butter to your bedtime hot cocoa, or jumping jacks before going to bed. Those techniques do help and they do add up but they don't match another inch or two of down or a rested, hydrated, well fed body.

    FWIW a fire would be my response to the situations you listed.

    Like you, I have had the misfortune of being part of a scary cold weather situation, not life threatening, but enough to open my eyes. As a result, I am something of a pack mule in the winter.
    Love my JRB BMB

  3. #193
    BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tjm View Post
    I hope this doesn't sound pissy cause it isn't intended that way. Tone is hard to "get" in thread postings...
    Not at all! Tone is indeed very difficult to interpret correctly onlone, for most of us.

    IMO a hot water bottle is a marginal aid, a bit of a psychological boost. I worry that people might think it can be considered as an important part of their sleep system.

    It is a nice trick, like adding some butter to your bedtime hot cocoa, or jumping jacks before going to bed. Those techniques do help and they do add up but they don't match another inch or two of down or a rested, hydrated, well fed body.

    FWIW a fire would be my response to the situations you listed.

    Like you, I have had the misfortune of being part of a scary cold weather situation, not life threatening, but enough to open my eyes. As a result, I am something of a pack mule in the winter.
    Yeah, I have been also most of my life. I do tend to go a bit lighter in recent years. Just curious(speaking of pack mule/weight), are you a synthetic or a down person?

    And speaking of fire, I do remember pulling into camp after hiking all day in a blowing WY June snowstorm.

    Everything was covered in a lot of new snow and it was still coming down. Most of us were probably starting to approach hypothermia already. One of my tarp mates was frantically trying to gather wood and start a fire while the other one and I were trying to get the tarp pitched in the high wind as fast as possible. In the end, we boiled water on the stove, shoveled in hot food and drink, gave up on the fire in the blowing snow, and burrowed into our mummy bags. Everything was at least damp, despite "waterproof" stuff sacks. One thing I was always grateful for was that all of my damp clothes and bag were synthetic.

    Also speaking of food, I slept that night ( bears be damned!) with a bag of sunflower seeds beside me, munching on them through the night. I still shivered all night! Shivered and peed! It might all be in my head, but I have sometimes wish I had known about the hot water bottle trick. I can't help but think a couple of Nalgenes filled with hot water would have been a real help tucked down inside my mummy bags! It had been 25 years and I've never had a night like that again. But if I was in that miserable condition, first thing I would do is start boiling water for that hot water bottle.

    It snowed all night, but things seemed brighter the next morning!

    That's me on the right. My friend on the left doesn't have big breasts. He is just trying to dry his socks and such.
    For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory that is to be revealed to us....that the creation itself also will be set free from its slavery to corruption into the freedom of the glory of the children of God. For we know that the whole creation groans and suffers the pains of childbirth together until now.
    Romans 8:18,21-22

  4. #194
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    Quote Originally Posted by BillyBob58 View Post
    Are you a synthetic or a down person?
    Good question, this will prove I am a pack mule...

    I kind of backed into winter camping and, as a result, I still nest sleeping bags. I use a BA Encampment 15*F syn semi-mummy with a MARMOT 15 *F down and an REI mid-wt. fleece liner.

    The liner was bought years ago as a "sleeping bag" for overnights at AMC huts in the Whites. It is now my summer TQ. The BA syn was my first bag and a bit of a mistake since it has too much internal space to work below 32*F for me. The MARMOT is my son's 3 season bag. I would buy a MARMOT again if I am ever in the market for a sleeping bag.

    Put them all together and I have been toasty down to 0*F with only a light base layer. The key is that the down mummy fits nicely into the syn semi-mummy.

    I expect these 3 bags will be my TQ if I hammock at overnight lows below 0*F this winter. This is my first winter in a hammock and I need/want to do it in increments to prove my UQ set-ups.

    I really can't winter camp without snow since I rely on a pulk to bring all the stuff.

    My clothing layers are a similar mish mash of poly / fleece / down / wool. Didn't intend to do that but in retrospect it is nice to have hedged my bets.

    Quote Originally Posted by BillyBob58 View Post
    But if I was in that miserable condition, first thing I would do is start boiling water for that hot water bottle.
    I agree the water bottle is a good technique and would have helped that night.

    "Oh #$%^, I could die here" moments really do stay with you, don't they?
    Love my JRB BMB

  5. #195
    Senior Member Buffalo Skipper's Avatar
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    Lots of good talk about when to use a hot water bottle and what to expect from it. I recently was talking about taking a 50° UQ and using it at 32° (here). I included a space blanket, wool blanket, thermal underwear (which I usually do not wear at night) and a hot water bottle as a means of being comfortable this weekend.

    Like you all, I have had an unpleasnat and memorable cold weather experience. Three years ago, I hiked 8 miles to a campsite in a wet snow, with several stream crossings. I ended up with wet feet, and by some poor planning, my back up socks got wet in the campsite as well. Forecast was for 23°, but temps plummeted to just below 10°. I had a very uncomfortable night in a 25° bag. Our isobutane stoves, which barely work at 20°, were worthless at 10°, so we could not even heat up water or cook effectively. My feet were so cold that night, I eventually put on some cotton socks, but I was not generating enough heat to do them any good. That was the most miserable night of my life.

    I have since changed my approach to footwear (boots and socks). I have also picked up a backup alcohol stove to use when temps are threatening to be below 30° (this may become my permanent backpack stove). In fact, my whole approach to cold weather camping has changed (for the better) and I am much more prepared than I ever was before.

    If I had a hot water bottle, I believe I would have been much more comfortable that weekend. It is a technique which I intend to deliver to my scouts if any of them is having a difficult time in cold weather, especially this January when we are at Mt Cheaha.
    “Indian builds small fire and stays warm, white man builds big fire and stays warm collecting firewood”—unknown

    “The cure for anything is salt water - sweat, tears, or the sea”—Karen Blixen

  6. #196
    Senior Member CajunHiker's Avatar
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    I just picked up a Stanley 24oz from WM for $5. Website says it's leakproof. I may use it this weekend if needed.
    Anyone else use one of these?
    http://www.shopstanley-pmi.com/detail/TCL+10-01042-001
    To Boldly Hang Where No One Has Hung Before...

  7. #197
    Senior Member Buffalo Skipper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CajunHiker View Post
    I just picked up a Stanley 24oz from WM for $5. Website says it's leakproof. I may use it this weekend if needed.
    Anyone else use one of these?
    http://www.shopstanley-pmi.com/detail/TCL+10-01042-001
    CajunHiker, the only concern I would have about his would be that the stainless steel is a really good transmitter of heat. Be sure if you put hot water in this that you have an insulating layer (sock, reflectix coozy, etc) to protect you. Boiling water will heat the outside to 210° and will burn you.
    “Indian builds small fire and stays warm, white man builds big fire and stays warm collecting firewood”—unknown

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  8. #198
    Senior Member CajunHiker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buffalo Skipper View Post
    CajunHiker, the only concern I would have about his would be that the stainless steel is a really good transmitter of heat. Be sure if you put hot water in this that you have an insulating layer (sock, reflectix coozy, etc) to protect you. Boiling water will heat the outside to 210° and will burn you.
    Will most definately be doing that. I had to use this trick a couple of years ago and used a cheap "nalgene-ish" bottle. I found that I didn't have enough insulation around the bottle resulting in an initially hot sleeping bag that tapered off left me cold by morning. I've got some scrap windshield reflector that I plan on making some coozies for it. Hopefully, that'll solve both the issues.
    To Boldly Hang Where No One Has Hung Before...

  9. #199
    Whoooo Buddy)))) Shug's Avatar
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    I have to sleep with my water in sub 0º Minnesota winters or I would have a bottle of ice in the morn'.
    It might as well be warm. I like it under my wrists for some reason.
    Shug
    Whoooo Buddy)))) I Love Onions, Grits, Greens, Livermush, NC Style BBQ, Potted Meat, Anchovies, 'Naner Puddin", Peanut Butter Pie, Red Velvet Cake and Cocoa and Straaaaaawwwwberrrry Milk and Coffee Crisps....
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  10. #200
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shug View Post
    I like it under my wrists for some reason.
    I read somewhere that the wrists are like radiators cause all the blood vessels are close to the surface. I imagine that heat would flow into your body more easily at the wrists as well.

    When I trying to prevent overheating, but don't want to stop to shed a layer, I will take off my hat, unzip layers to sterum strap, and pull up the sleeves on my arms up to my elbows, and even remove my gloves.
    Love my JRB BMB

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