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  1. #11
    G...Hawk's Avatar
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    Thanks All. I see by the response that a
    Burrow0* is the most practical for deep winter.

    Spent sometime at the site and began to realize that : the beautiful clean lines of the sewn end that I had grown to love,
    was less appropriate than the snap end that has endless variations to vent for warmer seasons.

    Going to order tonight.


    G
    trailname : Distracted By Stone

  2. #12
    I don't know what your DIY UQ will go down to, but I know my Incubator 0* UQ will go down to 0*. It has like 5"+ of loft.

    I'd really rethink the snap footbox, especially on a winter TQ. The snap one is much draftier and won't keep your feet nearly as warm as the sewn one. Check out the threads. On the other hand, if you can supplement your feet and want to use it into warmer weather, then maybe. I just drape mine over my feet when needed. I have a 40* Burrow (Sewn), which I've used to 29* very comfortably.

  3. #13
    Senior Member DemostiX's Avatar
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    Too much is too much

    G...Hawk:
    Note what Boomer just said: That a 40F rated Burrow did him fine 11d F below its rating when he was well insulated from below.

    That is exactly my extensive experience, too. The drape and seal matter much more for retaining warmth once you are protected from below. IMO, a 0F SB or TQ is needed only if you expect to be in -10F conditions. Yes, there is such a thing as too much. Too much fuss and bulk in the hammock to the extent that you cannot easily vent it. Maybe my experience is too much with smaller hammocks, but I doubt anyone with any bridge hammock would have an easy way to get lots of loft well out of the way to cool off in 30-40F temps. Where is it all to go?

    Further, if you overheat, then you sweat, and now you have a garment which is harder to launder getting more aromatic sooner.

    My advice is to err on too-much with the smaller UQ. On the same note: Do get a shorter TQ if you only need a shorter one. The extra length is not just of limited use; it is of negative utility.

  4. #14
    G...Hawk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boomer View Post
    I don't know what your DIY UQ will go down to, but I know my Incubator 0* UQ will go down to 0*. It has like 5"+ of loft.

    I'd really rethink the snap footbox, especially on a winter TQ. The snap one is much draftier and won't keep your feet nearly as warm as the sewn one. Check out the threads. On the other hand, if you can supplement your feet and want to use it into warmer weather, then maybe. I just drape mine over my feet when needed. I have a 40* Burrow (Sewn), which I've used to 29* very comfortably.
    My DIY IX-ripstop-combo-UQ has gone below 30*, perhaps 27* or more.
    With the Speer Snugfit all the way down to 3* last weekend at the NJWinterHang.
    This setup can be taken backpacking.

    Expect there is an Incubator0* in the future.

    Have tried to find posts commenting about the snap vs sewn end.
    Perhaps I will search further.

    Placed the order tonight, expect that can be adjusted between now and when it gets close to production.


    G
    Last edited by G...Hawk; 01-30-2013 at 22:46.
    trailname : Distracted By Stone

  5. #15
    G...Hawk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DemostiX View Post
    G...Hawk:
    Note what Boomer just said: That a 40F rated Burrow did him fine 11d F below its rating when he was well insulated from below.

    That is exactly my extensive experience, too. The drape and seal matter much more for retaining warmth once you are protected from below. IMO, a 0F SB or TQ is needed only if you expect to be in -10F conditions. Yes, there is such a thing as too much. Too much fuss and bulk in the hammock to the extent that you cannot easily vent it. Maybe my experience is too much with smaller hammocks, but I doubt anyone with any bridge hammock would have an easy way to get lots of loft well out of the way to cool off in 30-40F temps. Where is it all to go?

    Further, if you overheat, then you sweat, and now you have a garment which is harder to launder getting more aromatic sooner.

    My advice is to err on too-much with the smaller UQ. On the same note: Do get a shorter TQ if you only need a shorter one. The extra length is not just of limited use; it is of negative utility.
    Doing more research on sewn or snap Burrow0*.
    Seems most advise sewn for cold temps like the single-digits ( Jan NJWinterHang and Feb in NY Catskills ).

    My current backpacking setup has served me well to 30* so main concern is 30* to 0*. Expect the Burrow0* will be compelling in March.

    I am concerned about overheating and sweating, many people recommend just pulling a leg foot out for a while.

    G
    trailname : Distracted By Stone

  6. #16
    G...Hawk's Avatar
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    Sewn vs snap end : Have been reading opinions here and on archive posts about the wisdom of having a sewn footbox in very cold weather.

    Therefore have changed to a sewn footbox.

    G
    trailname : Distracted By Stone

  7. #17
    Senior Member
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    I think you made the right choice with the sewn foot box. After all it is a 0* quilt. If you bring it anywhere near its limit, you'll be glad that there will be one less thing to fiddle with to keep warm. Now all you needs is a matching 0* Incubator

    S

  8. #18
    G...Hawk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewinder View Post
    I think you made the right choice with the sewn foot box. After all it is a 0* quilt. If you bring it anywhere near its limit, you'll be glad that there will be one less thing to fiddle with to keep warm. Now all you needs is a matching 0* Incubator

    S

    Now all you needs is a matching 0* Incubator


    Have read about down addiction. Oh. . . man . . . have to be careful !
    If I had an Incubator0* . . . .


    G
    trailname : Distracted By Stone

  9. #19
    stevebo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by breyman View Post
    A 20* is (usually) the best choice for a first quilt. If you already have one, though, that runs around 30*, I'd think the 20* is too close to it, unless you're really going with something to save space/weight. If that's less of an issue, I'd personally go with the 0*, or perhaps at the most, a 20* with 2-3 ounces of overstuff to bring you down to around 10.
    I agree--------its a beautiful piece of equiptment, but as a cold sleeper, I would never take it down to 20 degrees!
    “The two most common elements in the universe are hydrogen and stupidity.”
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  10. #20
    Senior Member Str1der's Avatar
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    I agree with some of the advice above. The UQ is where you don't want to skimp on loft. It is also much easier (IMHO) to vent, so make sure that your UQ can handle the lowest low you intend to go . I've used my 0* Incubator in lows as high as the upper 50s without roasting by simply venting it well and adjusting my top insulation. Once you have your UQ options sorted, you can make TQ adjustments.

    The TQ can be easily supplimented with clothing, liners, or even a second TQ or sleeping bag if not backpacking, so I might err on the side of less warmth there. If you will be bringing down clothing for day warmth anyway, you might be able to save a few ounces on your TQ by simply wearing some of that clothing to bed. That practice might also serve you well if you need to get up during the night. If you do end up choosing the 0* TQ, then I wouldn't recomend the snaps. You upgraded from the 20* to the 0* for a reason, so why compomise the 0* with a less effective foot seal? If I were camping in weather that was cold enough to warrant a 0* TQ, I would make absolutely sure my feet were gonna be warm!
    Last edited by Str1der; 02-11-2013 at 09:07.
    "The Road goes ever on and on,
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    Until it joins some larger way
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    And whither then? I cannot say."
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