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  1. #31
    Member hecta_g's Avatar
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    Very good thread! I've a similar thread with the sheet bend and bowline comparison and glad to see I was in line with The Rat.

    As a scout leader I must know my knots and enjoy learning from others.

    Thanks The Rat!

    Oh, and as for the App, the Grog app is the only app to date that I have purchased and always refer to.
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  2. #32
    New Member Airmech27's Avatar
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    Knots

    Great knots, thanks!

  3. #33
    New Member Chrctr_Zero's Avatar
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    Double Duty for the Alpine Butterfly

    Quote Originally Posted by Knotty View Post
    Good stuff Rat. My one addition would be the Zeppelin Bend because of it's security and ease of untying even after heavy loading.

    http://www.animatedknots.com/zeppelin/
    The zeppelin bend has similar reliability as the alpine butterfly bend. If you can tie an alpine butterfly loop, you can also tie it as a bend, and then you have one less knot to remember...

  4. #34
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    *snip*
    Quote Originally Posted by Rat View Post
    Trucker's/Driver's Hitch This hitch has many names, but this is the only way to tie it properly. You can also double wrap the bitter end to get a better mechanical advantage. Once wrapped three times or so the rope will generally grab and hold itself while you finish the half hitches, very handy.
    Is there any reason that this is true when there are many variants of this knot?

    I never knew I was using a directional figure 8 but this was how I tied this knot until I became sick of how difficult it could sometimes be to untie on thicker ropes that had been rain-soaked.

    I was shown to use a simple overhand loop in the standing line, which pops out fairly easily with a tug most of the time. I have used this variation to secure canoes to roof-racks, rig tarp ridgelines, clotheslines, and to secure loads in truck-beds for years and it has never revealed itself to be flawed in security. I still find the overhand loop can be difficult to pull out when the line is wet and sprayed with dirt/sand or when working with large diameter rope.

    Is it simply that the directional figure 8 is a superior knot that gives the least loss of rope strength? Most rope I've used has been greatly over-rated for the task at hand so maybe the figure 8 simply isn't necessary for a lot of what we do with this knot. I'd like to know if I'm on the right track here.

    Since I'm still rambling on, I very recently picked up a new variation of this knot called the "truckie hitch" that employs what appears to be a bellringer's knot in the standing line to form the loop that the bitter end is passed through. Nothing I've ever tied and loaded comes apart so easily once the load is removed.

    Here is a video of the truckie hitch that I'm sure is worth more than 1000 words if you are curious about it:
    Trucker's Hitch versus Truckie Hitch

    I'm pretty new to knots in general but I've been putting a lot of effort into learning as much as possible over the past year or two. Thank you so much for putting together this thread and taking the time to pass on what I think is just about the most undervalued skill-set today. I'm so sick of showing people a basic hitch and having them reply, "Well I just tie overhand knots until it sticks. When I want the rope off I just cut it."

  5. #35
    Rat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hashiba View Post
    *snip*


    Is there any reason that this is true when there are many variants of this knot?
    Only because this is how it is described in ABoK and so named. Variants are just that, variations of this knot as described by ABoK as we are using ABoK as the source.

    In fact, I use a variant similar to the slipknot variant that is both easy to tie and untie. The ABoK is the most secure though.

    I would not use a half a sheepshank like the truckie hitch uses; the sheepshank will spill very easily, especially in modern synthetic ropes. Pull hard enough and you can collapse the sheepshank; if the load lightens enough the sheepshank will spill as well. I would not trust it...
    "I aim to misbehave." - Capt. Mal Reynolds
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  6. #36
    Senior Member jbrescue's Avatar
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    Either I missed something or, the Tautline hitch was excluded. This is an essential knot for the outdoors and a required one for Scouts.

    As a technical rescue guy, I can say this, the more you can do without hardware, the better you will be. Too many people get reliant on carabiners and straps. You can do almost anything with rope and good knot skills.
    Jason Brooks
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  7. #37
    packeagle's Avatar
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    Re: Essential Outdoor Knots, according to Rat!

    Quote Originally Posted by jbrescue View Post
    Either I missed something or, the Tautline hitch was excluded. This is an essential knot for the outdoors and a required one for Scouts.

    As a technical rescue guy, I can say this, the more you can do without hardware, the better you will be. Too many people get reliant on carabiners and straps. You can do almost anything with rope and good knot skills.
    The midshipmans hitch is the taught line hitch.

    The Boy Scouts, actually published a less than ideal variation.
    Read here for more info:
    http://www.animatedknots.com/rollinghitch/

    This variation works much better, IMO.
    http://www.animatedknots.com/imagesp...ling_hitch.jpg

  8. #38
    Senior Member jbrescue's Avatar
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    I never heard it called that before. Good to know.
    Jason Brooks
    IAFF Local 2388
    ASM Troop 140
    North Ridgeville, Ohio

  9. #39
    Need to go practice tying knots

  10. #40
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    Awesome Rat, thanks for the reply.

    I recently tied a ridgeline with the "truckie hitch" in some 3mm cord and mightily as I pulled, it did not spill. I tred this again with some higher quality "techline" with a 1.9 mm diameter, and she spilled instantly. I think I'll go back to a slipping loop again.

    I have to invest in a copy of ABOK soon. I love knots.

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