View Full Version : Berlin - Weekend 31 October
bigfanboy
08-24-2015, 17:05
So I will be in Berlin all the week of November 2nd. I hate working with jet lag so I will look to fly in Friday morning 30 October. And I am Interested in places to hang outside of Berlin by say 2 hours or less.
bigfanboy
09-09-2015, 15:55
Bump to this, I am looking for advice. I land in TXL on the 29th and do not have to report to work until the evening of Nov 2nd. I will have a car so driving a distance is not a huge issue. Where can I go to get a nice say 30 mile hike in, see some great German landscape NOT a caravan site. All while sleeping comfortably in my Hammock at night :)
Martin_1
09-09-2015, 19:40
I am not entirely sure how far away it is from Berlin but I would go to the Harz mountains. Harz Mittelgebirge with it's highest peak the Brocken. Don't go to the Brocken itself though. That's extremely touristy (made up a word there :laugh: ) and has some radio stuff on the top placed by the DDR.
Find a nice small town, buy a map, dump the car, wander in to the forest. The Harz has some beautiful areas and some very old towns with those buildings made of lyme and wood (Fachwerkhäuser).
The best area around there would probably be this:
http://www.mecklenburgische-seenplatte.de/seenplatte_erleben/Englische_Landingspage/index.html
It is the largest lakeland area in central Europe, the biggest of the lakes beeing the Müritz lake. There are plenty of hiking trails, some really beautiful sights. Keep in mind that Germany is rather densely populated, so I don't know how far away from civilisation you can truley get. But there will be some good spots.
It is probably about an hour of driving to the north west from Berlin. Apart from that, there are some larger forested areas to the north, but I don't know if they are any good. Apparently there are some pretty cool sites like an abandoned asylum or something (which is of course private property).
Now, for the legal aspects: This is my personal interpretation of the law and may not reflect the actual practice. Plus you may have some trouble delivering the message, if any official should confront you.
(Tent)Camping is prohibited in nature reserves (and they are very quick to declare untouched nature as nature reserve) according to Sec. 23 Subsection 2 of the German Federal Nature Protection Act. Anything that destroys, damages, changes or sustainably disturbs anything is prohibited. My take on that is that if you use your hammock and adhere to LNT principles, you should be fine. I have done so several times, but nobody has ever found me hangin ;)
Maybe some other Germans in this forum have some more advice for you???
Enjoy your trip! Post some pictures if you end up going to the lake district.
The Harz is a beautiful area too, but its probably about 3.5 hours to drive there from Berlin.
Mittagsfrost
09-25-2015, 09:02
@bigfanboy, I draw attention of some Berlin hangers to your post. I hope they'll respond.
bigfanboy
09-25-2015, 16:30
@bigfanboy, I draw attention of some Berlin hangers to your post. I hope they'll respond.
Great thanks,
So we have decided where we am going.
A buddy and I are going to hike just two sections of the (and I am sorry if I am getting this wrong) Malerweg in Saxon Switzerland National Park. We are going to do Stage 4 and 5, we have not decided in which direct yet, 4 to 5 or 5 to 4. We are also working on where to park our rental car safely, so if anyone has any advice for this, that would be great. We are coming in early to a work project in Berlin so we will be driving down from TXL Airport 2-3 hrs or so it looks like. We will have 3.5 days to do this small hike. Which is exactly what I am looking for, as we are going to working to get over jet lag, and I am still in bad physical shape and working on changing that.
The plan is to camp "Boofen" or "wild" camping, which everything i read says it accepted as long as you follow "leave no trace", which is an "of course!!" for me.
Thoughts?
I haven't been there yet, but it's supposed to be beautiful. Good choice.
bigfanboy
09-25-2015, 18:48
What weather should I expect in late October early November? Temp ranges?
You should probably check for a more accurate forecast before you leave, but on average the temps in October are around 45 degrees. Since it's the end of October already, probably more around 40 degrees. At night it can go down to about 30 degrees. You may get some frost already. The weather itself can change pretty quickly around that time of the year. But for only 4 days you should be able to get a pretty accurate forecast before you leave.
jolunder
09-26-2015, 06:27
You choose a beautiful area for your hike. I haven't done any hiking there myself (yet) as my visit this year was with the family.
A good place to park the car might be Bad Schandau. It's a small town not far away from some sections ofthe Malerweg. If I recall correctly you can get to most sections of this hike from Bad Schandau via public transport. The tourist office in Bad Schandau left a really good impression on me, they should have any info you need.
Sleeping in the Boofen does mean no hammock though. The right to sleep there really only it's granted to climbers by definition. But I hear that in practice hikers are tolerated is they follow all the other rules, such as strictly cowboy camping with LNT-Practice. I plan on doing the Malerweg myself, this is why I researched this info in the past. This means it's only theoretical knowledge, I haven't got to try it out yet ;)
Enjoy your time in this stunning scenery!
bigfanboy
09-26-2015, 13:55
You choose a beautiful area for your hike. I haven't done any hiking there myself (yet) as my visit this year was with the family.
A good place to park the car might be Bad Schandau. It's a small town not far away from some sections ofthe Malerweg. If I recall correctly you can get to most sections of this hike from Bad Schandau via public transport. The tourist office in Bad Schandau left a really good impression on me, they should have any info you need.
Sleeping in the Boofen does mean no hammock though. The right to sleep there really only it's granted to climbers by definition. But I hear that in practice hikers are tolerated is they follow all the other rules, such as strictly cowboy camping with LNT-Practice. I plan on doing the Malerweg myself, this is why I researched this info in the past. This means it's only theoretical knowledge, I haven't got to try it out yet ;)
Enjoy your time in this stunning scenery!
What makes you say "no hammock"?
jolunder
09-26-2015, 15:11
As I understood the rules, you are strictly required to stay in the "Boofe". Those seemingly are mostly little overhangs in the rock. You are only allowed to bivouac there. No hammock is my personal interpretation. According to what I found in a German forum the rangers do patrol these sites.
Mittagsfrost
09-26-2015, 16:47
Jolunder is right. I do not recomend any kind of stealth camping in the national park. The rangers will find you. I lived in the Saxon Switzerland area for about 15 years and I know what I am talking about. With climbing rope in your backpacks you will be tolerated, when you leave no trace and sleep in a boofe. Not a climber? Caught at any other place within the borders of the National park? Hope the ranger has a very very good day.
I suggest to spend the day on Malerweg and at the evening leave the territory of the National park to find some trees to hang the hammock. It's not so far away as the National park isn't very large.
bigfanboy
09-26-2015, 18:58
Jolunder is right. I do not recomend any kind of stealth camping in the national park. The rangers will find you. I lived in the Saxon Switzerland area for about 15 years and I know what I am talking about. With climbing rope in your backpacks you will be tolerated, when you leave no trace and sleep in a boofe. Not a climber? Caught at any other place within the borders of the National park? Hope the ranger has a very very good day.
I suggest to spend the day on Malerweg and at the evening leave the territory of the National park to find some trees to hang the hammock. It's not so far away as the National park isn't very large.
Interesting because I read in a few other posts on other forums, from August that people hung quietly off the trail, and as long as they did not light a fire and left no trace they were ok.
Interesting how National Land differs from country to country. In the U.S. it's the State Parks you have to worry about, National land is almost too open. Though Germany is roughly half the size of TX so much less land for the rangers to patrol.
Jolunder is right. I do not recomend any kind of stealth camping in the national park. The rangers will find you. I lived in the Saxon Switzerland area for about 15 years and I know what I am talking about. With climbing rope in your backpacks you will be tolerated, when you leave no trace and sleep in a boofe. Not a climber? Caught at any other place within the borders of the National park? Hope the ranger has a very very good day.
I suggest to spend the day on Malerweg and at the evening leave the territory of the National park to find some trees to hang the hammock. It's not so far away as the National park isn't very large.
Just out of curiosity, on what legal basis would the stealth hammock camping be prohibited and how do the rangers find you if you hike off trail for a few minutes at dusk, then hike out again at dawn, make no fire and leave no trace?
Just out of curiosity, on what legal basis would the stealth hammock camping be prohibited
Never mind that part, I found it and it is just like Mittagsfrost said: it's the NLPR-VO (Verordnung des Sächsischen Staatsministeriums für Umwelt und Landwirtschaft über die Nationalparkregion Sächsische Schweiz, some state regulation). Relevant parts would be Section 6, "Prohibitions". They start of the same as the federal statute and then enumerate some particulars like leaving marked trails or staying the night in unmarked or outside of permitted areas (no. 16 and 17). There is an exception in Section 7 if you obtain prior written permission, however, they claim to not grant a permission on this subject. In my personal opinion, that does not leave a lot of room for interpretation or discussion. But there is a distiction between the national park and the nature reserve. The regulations on the nature reserve do not contain a prohibition towards staying the night in a hammock. So once you leave the national park, you should be good.
Mittagsfrost
09-27-2015, 06:52
Trust me, the rangers are experienced men. But If you leave no trace, make no fire, no noise, no odor and may be no infrared radiation (body heat) it would be very difficult to find you hidden and away from the trail.
I think the fear of being caught and punished may ruin the pleasure of spending the night in a wonderful surrounding.
:laugh: I did not think about thermal imaging. Thanks for the advice :) Maybe a sock out of refelctix :laugh:
bigfanboy
09-27-2015, 11:38
Trust me, the rangers are experienced men. But If you leave no trace, make no fire, no noise, no odor and may be no infrared radiation (body heat) it would be very difficult to find you hidden and away from the trail.
I think the fear of being caught and punished may ruin the pleasure of spending the night in a wonderful surrounding.
Obviously I can cover all but the infrared :)
Assuming I am only doing Stage 4 and 5. No time to do more on this trip. Can either of you of point me to maps that show the boundary of the Nature Preserve and the National Park? Also it looks from my research that these rules apply to what my google translator is being called the "core area". Again if I am going from Malerweg stage 4 to stage 5 which ends not far from Bad Schandau, how can I tell where the boundary is, where I would be safe to stealth camp
bigfanboy
09-27-2015, 11:41
It looks like maybe this is representative of the difference?
http://homepage.usys.ethz.ch/sewolf/PICS/SaxonSwitzerland-Location.png
Dark Green being the "core zone" light green being the "nature Preserve"?
Mittagsfrost
09-27-2015, 16:22
The hatched zone is the National park, where camping and fire are prohibited except of special sleeping spots (Boofen) and fire places. The green marked territory is the core zone (no sleeping, no fire, no leaving of the paths).
I assume, you are going from Altendorf via Neumannmühle to Schmilka. Right? So you have to deal with the strong rules of the core zone. But it's worth the limitations. You chose very beautiful area. You won't regret. Oh, I wish I could join you!
I think Mittagsfrost is more knowledgeable here. But I would interpret your map differently. The national park covers under a 100 square km. If I look at the map that can only be the green part. There are maps that contain details, but I can't find them online. I guess the distinction is irrelevant for most ppl.
bigfanboy
09-28-2015, 15:15
First off, thanks very much for all the advice, lots to think about, and having someone "close" to challenge always helps
OK using these maps a long with GPX files for my GPS to plan.
stage 4 - http://www.outdooractive.com/itextpdf/getPdf?style=alpregio&key=ar-saechsische-schweiz&i=6587405&layout=map&fixscalemap=50000
stage 5 - http://www.outdooractive.com/itextpdf/getPdf?style=alpregio&key=ar-saechsische-schweiz&i=6587497&layout=map&fixscalemap=50000
It looks like on these maps that the border for the park is not far from the trail and we could "step out" find a stealthy place and get a good night's kip.
Alternatively if you go to this google map I put together https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=zzS5xbk5TboI.ki7oFGVoLVg8&usp=sharing you can see all the "official" boofen spots in the core areas for stage 4 and 5.
To use those boofen you would suggest we carry a rope on our packs to make it seem like we are climbing?
That border in stage 5 of the park is also the border of Germany. Beyond that Czech law will apply. I don't know anything about that. But I would assume they have some similarly strict rules in their part of the National Park. On the stage 4 part it looks like you will be able to step out at some points.
bigfanboy
09-29-2015, 12:11
OK more info needed from you guys, what store do I look for canisters like this;
http://www.amazon.com/Optimus-Canister-Fuel-3-88oz/dp/B00183TNTM/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1443546604&sr=8-3&keywords=camping+gas
http://www.amazon.de/Optimus-Gaskartusche-230g/dp/B007ZZVSWW/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1443548182&sr=8-2&keywords=optimus+gas+kartusche
Lol, not sure you had that in mind, but you could just order it on the German Amazon, they have the same product available. It's even cheaper in Germany :laugh: 4 oz would be the 100g.
bigfanboy
09-29-2015, 12:43
Yeah but I need a store to walk into and buy it onsite, while driving from Airport to Camping.
If you are looking for a store in Berlin, they have it online, so they will probably have it or smth comparable in Berlin. https://www.globetrotter.de/shop/optimus-schraubkartusche-268671-gruen
This is their store address in Berlin: Schloßstraße 78 - 82, 12165 Berlin
You can email them and ask for availability:
[email protected]
I think its about 15 minutes driving from the airport...
bigfanboy
09-29-2015, 12:49
If you are looking for a store in Berlin, they have it online, so they will probably have it or smth comparable in Berlin. https://www.globetrotter.de/shop/optimus-schraubkartusche-268671-gruen
This is their store address in Berlin: Schloßstraße 78 - 82, 12165 Berlin
You can email them and ask for availability:
[email protected]
Excellent!!, Thanks for that, they also look to have a store in Dresden, we are going to head to Dresden for some Tourist stuff first so that will work out great.
Mittagsfrost
09-29-2015, 13:39
The Globetrotter store in Dresden is not far away from the main railway station (Hauptbahnhof). The adress is Prager Strasse 10.
There is also a very little outdoor shop called "Der Insider" at Marktstrasse 4 in Bad Schandau.
bigfanboy
11-05-2015, 17:34
So I went I hung, I conquered!
We only ended up, due to work restriction, being able to do Stage4. We met TONS of locals as it was a national holiday. On trails I assumed I would only see maybe 20-30 people we saw hundreds.
To anyone thinking of going to part of Germany, I HIGHLY recommend it!!
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That looks great! Really nice weather too! I'm glad you enjoyed it! And glad you managed to get some hanging done:cool:
jolunder
11-06-2015, 07:14
Looks good!
bigfanboy
11-06-2015, 08:08
Also wanted to say, though they were very cautious talking to me about it, I met quite a few locals who were camping in the Park. They just said find the dark woods, of which there were plenty, and be careful, LNT, no fire, etc. And I spoke to some climbers and they were pretty sure if someone slung a hammock at a boofen no one would. So it might not be so bad to consider camping in Saxon Switzerland National Park.
Mittagsfrost
11-08-2015, 16:48
Wonderful pictures and, I assume, a nice visit to Saxony.
bigfanboy
11-08-2015, 19:44
Awesome, I will be back soon to hike more of it.
bigfanboy
11-08-2015, 19:44
Also a big fan of Dresden now.
Hey bigfanboy, great that you had such a wonderful experience. Where did you hang? The spot in the picture doesn't look stealthy at all to me.
: )
Cheers, babaloo